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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lily of the Nile View Post
    Yes I know they are there. Why I used this example is because if they weren't there and only written about people wouldn't believe it even though it's true.
    That doesn't make sense



    ...and you ignored the queston in teh second part of my post.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by FiveInTheBed View Post
    But they ARE there.

    That is MY point.

    We don't have to 'imagine' that pyramids existed because there is evidence of them existing.

    The Earth has seen many disasters, yes. Ice ages, floods, being hit by space rock.
    And they have all helped shape the lives of the inhabitants...

    This story of Noah's Ark is where God gives permission to Man to eat meat and repopulate the Earth. How did this one family do this?
    You know there is much more reliable proof (the type we don't have to imagine) that humans as we know them today stem from Africa?
    This is starting to feel like a bit of an attack and is really getting away from the original point. If anyone wants to keep talking about doctrine and translation I'm happy to do that but I'm not really interested in debating whether or not the bible is "real" or not. I've got all the proof I need for my beliefs and am really comfortable with that.

    Thanks all, it's been fun

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  4. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justwant2beamummy View Post
    This is starting to feel like a bit of an attack and is really getting away from the original point. If anyone wants to keep talking about doctrine and translation I'm happy to do that but I'm not really interested in debating whether or not the bible is "real" or not. I've got all the proof I need for my beliefs and am really comfortable with that.

    Thanks all, it's been fun
    I'm not actaully attacking at all.

    PLease feel free to show me what words I used to do so though and I will re frrame them.

    I'm asking people to explain what they think and how they translate the stories, critique them and use them in their day to day lives.

    Not all Christians take the Bible literally - that has been said.


    I know the Bible is "real'' - it s a compilation made up of 60 odd books. What I'm seriosuly curious about is how people translate those stories and compare them to what we have found in modern times
    Last edited by FiveInTheBed; 02-03-2012 at 18:23.

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    And I think we have all said that we don't necessarily use scientific "proof" to explain things, that faith is why we believe. I'm not sure what else you want us to say?

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  7. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by FiveInTheBed View Post
    That doesn't make sense



    ...and you ignored the queston in teh second part of my post.
    Really it doesn't make sense? I can't explain it any different, let me think so it does and I'll come back to it...

    I missed the question, what was it?

  8. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justwant2beamummy View Post
    And I think we have all said that we don't necessarily use scientific "proof" to explain things, that faith is why we believe. I'm not sure what else you want us to say?

    I'm curious why some dismiss proof, and rather favour 'faith' that something (something that sounds quite impossible) happened.
    I've asked a few little things along the way that have been ignored.


    Some people I speak to truly understand teh concept of evolution, and use the Bible in their lives simply because they 'like the message' (although that 'message' has been edited and revised over time )...they can grasp that the Earth is Billions of years old, but they like to say that there is a 'force' that created it.


    All I am doing is conversing - asking questions, presenting other pieces of information and asking your take in it.
    Last edited by FiveInTheBed; 02-03-2012 at 18:56.

  9. #67
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    Ok. IF the pyramids (just as an example) were destroyed 3 thousand years ago and in 1960 someone discovered written text talking about them, and in the text it talks about how big they were, how tall they were and how men built them with stones a certain size and pulled them to site and pulled them up etc etc.
    Would architects and scientists believe they ever existed? Would they say, is it even possible? How could man build such big structures as tombs of all things, in 20 years! With no machinery how's it possible to build them that high? How did they get the stones up the top? How did they get such a huge square meterage of space straight with no tools? It's so hard to build a building today with all our technology, setting out a building is difficult.... Etc etc.
    And because it's so hard to believe and couldn't answer questions they said no, they never existed, it's not possible.

    BUT because they are there, we know they're real, we know they were built and knowing we still don't have the answers and still find it difficult to understand how they were built exactly. But we have no choice but to believe because we see it.
    So if they were destroyed and they were only written about, do you accept that people would refuse to believe they ever existed? Because its very likely that they'd be dismissed as myth.

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  11. #68
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    [QUOTE=FiveInTheBed;6414774]But they ARE there.

    That is MY point.

    We don't have to 'imagine' that pyramids existed because there is evidence of them existing.

    The Earth has seen many disasters, yes. Ice ages, floods, being hit by space rock.
    And they have all helped shape the lives of the inhabitants...

    This story of Noah's Ark is where God gives permission to Man to eat meat and repopulate the Earth. How did this one family do this?
    You know there is much more reliable proof (the type we don't have to imagine) that humans as we know them today stem from Africa?[/
    QUOTE]

    Quote Originally Posted by Lily of the Nile View Post
    Really it doesn't make sense? I can't explain it any different, let me think so it does and I'll come back to it...

    I missed the question, what was it?
    I quoted and bolded it for you


    I know what you are trying to say, I understand that. But what you are trying to say could very much be said like this, "Just because there isn't evidence for fairies at the bottom of the Garden doesn't mean they didn't exist, they have been written about in many many books."

    Like I said - I can 'get' how people take the story of Noah's ark as a metaphor... a metaphor maybe about a church.

    But when asked simple questions like, When all the animals walked out of the Ark - how did all the predators [meat eaters] not wipe out their prey in a couple of bites?
    Then it jutst all comes down to 'faith'.

  12. #69
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    [QUOTE=FiveInTheBed;6414910]
    Quote Originally Posted by FiveInTheBed View Post
    But they ARE there.

    That is MY point.

    We don't have to 'imagine' that pyramids existed because there is evidence of them existing.

    The Earth has seen many disasters, yes. Ice ages, floods, being hit by space rock.
    And they have all helped shape the lives of the inhabitants...

    This story of Noah's Ark is where God gives permission to Man to eat meat and repopulate the Earth. How did this one family do this?
    You know there is much more reliable proof (the type we don't have to imagine) that humans as we know them today stem from Africa?[/
    QUOTE]



    I quoted and bolded it for you


    I know what you are trying to say, I understand that. But what you are trying to say could very much be said like this, "Just because there isn't evidence for fairies at the bottom of the Garden doesn't mean they didn't exist, they have been written about in many many books."

    Like I said - I can 'get' how people take the story of Noah's ark as a metaphor... a metaphor maybe about a church.

    But when asked simple questions like, When all the animals walked out of the Ark - how did all the predators [meat eaters] not wipe out their prey in a couple of bites?
    Then it jutst all comes down to 'faith'.
    But we're not talking about fairies, we're talking about historical structures and whether it's possible to build something or whether it was possible.
    And my answer to that is there are structures we can see and study today with still no understanding how it was built, so dismissing something just because it's written in the bible and seems unreal doesn't mean it's not possible.

    I'll come back to your question once kids are in bed.

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  14. #70
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    [QUOTE=Lily of the Nile;6414929]
    Quote Originally Posted by FiveInTheBed View Post

    But we're not talking about fairies, we're talking about historical structures and whether it's possible to build something or whether it was possible.
    And my answer to that is there are structures we can see and study today with still no understanding how it was built, so dismissing something just because it's written in the bible and seems unreal doesn't mean it's not possible.

    I'll come back to your question once kids are in bed.
    ..but people HAVE tried to investigate how this Ark worked.
    People have tried to build replicas and determine if what is explained in teh Bible would actually work or not.
    Even without the remians of that boat there - there ARE people trying to work it out. It actaully hasn't been 'dismissed'.
    It is certainly being investigated.

    And even though some people see it as a metaphor, some still see it as a fact, where others a happy with it being a fable.

    It's not just us debating this ...it has been raging for hundreds of years.

    It's not actually the boat itself that I am (personally) questioning in this thread though... it's the life that came from it.


 

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