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  1. #651
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    One little thing which is bugging the hell out of me at the moment is a website I keep seeing advertised in the Country Home Ideas magazines. It is called Somethings Country. It should be either Some Things Country or Something's Country depending on what they intend the name to mean, right? Somethings Country just looks so WRONG!

    Oh and a pet peeve of mine when it comes to pronunciation is ending '-ing' words with 'ink' ie Somethink, Anythink etc. Aaaaargh!!!!

  2. #652
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    Lambjam, you should read the contents of your links before you use them to support your claims.

    I'm referring to rules not recommendations

    Interesting to see how many people confuse the two.


    Mezmerised - lol!

  3. #653
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    lambjam is offline Nitwit! Blubber! Oddment! Tweak!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pussyfoot View Post
    Lambjam, you should read the contents of your links before you use them to support your claims.

    I'm referring to rules not recommendations

    Interesting to see how many people confuse the two.


    Mezmerised - lol!
    I did read them...

    Can you please elaborate?

    ETA As for rules and recommendations, all I've said is that different style manuals have different standards regarding apostrophe use, but most modern style manuals will instruct you to add the extra "s". This means that some published books and newspapers will not use it, but most will.

    I've just checked the Chicago Manual of Style's Q&A section and found this pertinent question, I hope it suffices as evidence that at least one style manual recommends the use of the "s" and that style manuals change their recommendations from edition to edition. I hope it also suffices as evidence that recommendations are often all we have to go by, as there aren't always universal, hard and fast rules applied to these kinds of things.

    I never thought I'd say it, but I'm all out of apostrophe love for now. Might head over to the FF section for a less rigorous debate!
    Last edited by lambjam; 25-04-2011 at 08:38.

  4. #654
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    Quote Originally Posted by lambjam View Post
    I did read them...

    Can you please elaborate?

    ETA As for rules and recommendations, all I've said is that different style manuals have different standards regarding apostrophe use, but most modern style manuals will instruct you to add the extra "s". This means that some published books and newspapers will not use it, but most will.

    I've just checked the Chicago Manual of Style's Q&A section and found this, I hope it suffices as enough evidence that at least one style manual recommends the use of the "s" and that style manuals change their recommendations from edition to edition. I hope it also suffices as evidence that recommendations are often all we have to go by, as there aren't always hard and fast rules applied to these kinds of things.

    I never thought I'd say it, but I'm all out of apostrophe love for now. Might head over to the FF section for a less rigorous debate!
    Well I've got here in front of me a Thomas & Friends book (the "James" one), published in Great Britain, and they write James' all through it, never James's. The former is how I've mostly seen it, especially in books.

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  6. #655
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    Quote Originally Posted by LG View Post
    Well I've got here in front of me a Thomas & Friends book (the "James" one), published in Great Britain, and they write James' all through it, never James's. The former is how I've mostly seen it, especially in books.
    So... they've either used a different style manual, or it was published under the recommendations of an earlier edition.

    As I said, these are not universal or hard and fast rules! You are not incorrect in not using the "s", at worst you are applying a style that is unpopular or out of date.

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    As I said, these are not universal or hard and fast rules! You are not incorrect in not using the "s", at worst you are applying a style that is unpopular or out of date.
    Aha, backpeddling are we? For a start, Australian grammar does not subscribe to American grammar which is what some of your links and your latest reference panders to. Secondly, there are hard and fast rules. It's only certain elements of modern society with its inherent laziness that opt for usurping these rules or making "recommendations" (as they call it) in an attempt to dumb down or "simplify" (as they call it) the language. Just because something is acceptable to some doesn't make it correct.

    James's is incorrect and you will not find it used in reputable publications.

  8. #657
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    Ok, last attempt.

    From Lynne Truss's famous Eats, Shoots & Leaves (which I cannot link to, so have instead typed out from my own copy, so keen am I to back up what I've stated):

    "Current guides to punctuation (including that ultimate authority, Fowler's Modern English Usage) state that with modern names ending in "s" (including biblical names, and any foreign names with an unpronounced final "s"), the "s" is required after the apostrophe:

    Keats's poems
    Philippa Jones's book
    St James's Square
    Alexander Dumas's The Three Musketeers

    With names from the ancient world, it is not:

    Archimedes' screw
    Achilles' heel

    If the name ends in an "iz" sound, an exception is made:

    Bridges' score
    Moses' tablets

    And an exception is always made for Jesus:

    Jesus' disciples

    However, these are matters of style and preference that are definitely not set in stone, and it's a good idea not to get fixated about them."

    My bold.

    Please note that Fowler's Modern English Usage is a British publication, published by Oxford University Press (a publisher reputable enough for most people). Further, Oxford's own style guide Hart's Rules for Compositors and Readers at the University Press describes examples such as "Jesus'" as "an accepted liturgical archaism", an archaism because it is no longer current.

    I usually love a good discussion, but am finding this pretty tiresome. I have gone to a fair bit of trouble to back up what I've stated, not because I want to win an argument but because I believe in backing up what I say (that, and the fact that I'm a little bit obsessed with apostrophes).

    Those who are arguing with me haven't bothered to put forward any evidence, rather just putting forward what they believe to be correct. Believe me, if I've got it wrong I'm going to be the first to want to know so I can correct my practices; however no-one has actually given me any reason to believe I've got it wrong. So, short of someone posting some compelling evidence rather than opinion, here ends my contribution to this part of the discussion.
    Last edited by lambjam; 25-04-2011 at 16:04.

  9. #658
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    A high school teacher just updated her Facebook status to "I brought a house!"

    *facepalm*

  10. #659
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    Quote Originally Posted by lambjam View Post
    Ok, last attempt.

    From Lynne Truss's famous Eats, Shoots & Leaves (which I cannot link to, so have instead typed out from my own copy, so keen am I to back up what I've stated):

    "Current guides to punctuation (including that ultimate authority, Fowler's Modern English Usage) state that with modern names ending in "s" (including biblical names, and any foreign names with an unpronounced final "s"), the "s" is required after the apostrophe:

    Keats's poems
    Philippa Jones's book
    St James's Square
    Alexander Dumas's The Three Musketeers

    With names from the ancient world, it is not:

    Archimedes' screw
    Achilles' heel

    If the name ends in an "iz" sound, an exception is made:

    Bridges' score
    Moses' tablets

    And an exception is always made for Jesus:

    Jesus' disciples

    However, these are matters of style and preference that are definitely not set in stone, and it's a good idea not to get fixated about them."

    My bold.

    Please note that Fowler's Modern English Usage is a British publication, published by Oxford University Press (a publisher reputable enough for most people). Further, Oxford's own style guide Hart's Rules for Compositors and Readers at the University Press describes examples such as "Jesus'" as "an accepted liturgical archaism", an archaism because it is no longer current.

    I usually love a good discussion, but am finding this pretty tiresome. I have gone to a fair bit of trouble to back up what I've stated, not because I want to win an argument but because I believe in backing up what I say (that, and the fact that I'm a little bit obsessed with apostrophes).

    Those who are arguing with me haven't bothered to put forward any evidence, rather just putting forward what they believe to be correct. Believe me, if I've got it wrong I'm going to be the first to want to know so I can correct my practices; however no-one has actually given me any reason to believe I've got it wrong. So, short of someone posting some compelling evidence rather than opinion, here ends my contribution to this part of the discussion.
    I've listened Lamb. I've noted.

  11. #660
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    Hahahaha friend's FB status:

    "had a fun weekend with Josh (spoilt him Wrotton"

    Ok...


 

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