How young is too young to introduce an expressed bottle when B-Feeding?

**MilliesMumma** · 18-12-2010 20:10

I am thinking about expressing, so I can get some help from DP and also for when we go shopping etc...and eventually when i have a night out.

I'm a bit worried that introducing a teet too early may cause problems with baby going back onto my nipple as easily as she does now. And I would hate to ruin how well her b-feeding is.

Also,
How will I know how much to express out (in mls) for each feed? Im not sure how much she would need depending on what age she is when i do decide to express.

Will I have to express each feed into a seperate bottle?
For eg: 6 feeds, would i have to have 6 seperate bottles with the correct amount of mls in it?

This is my first baby and frst time breast feeding so i have ALOT of questions

Any advice or tips would be great!!

**kar** · 18-12-2010 20:18

The general rule seems to be not before 6 weeks because of the nipple confusion issue.
From (hazy) memory yes, each feed needs to be separate, although the issue is that you can't reuse milk Bub has already drunk from, so you are best to freeze in smallish batches and defrost and use as needed.
There is a rough formula to work out vaguely how much each feed but I cant remember, someone will post it I'm sure.

**peanutbutter&jelly** · 18-12-2010 20:19

First q - age? About 6 weeks for your supply (otherwise you an end up engorged etc), for an occasional bottle, she should be ok to go whenever, if she'll take one at all

The amount you need to express depends on weight and number of feeds in 24 hours - I think its 150ml x body weight divided by how many feeds in a day?
I'm sure if I'm wrong someone can correct me

So for DD, she's 10.75kg, she has about 6 feeds a day I guess (a couple overnight, one in the morning, one in the middle of the day, one before bed), so 150 x 10.75 = 1612.5ml (Jeepers!!!!!!!) divided by 6 = 268.75ml

And for ease of defrosting, each feed into a bottle, or into a few milk storage bags is good. Or even into a few bottles and whoever is doing the feed can combine them, its just the waste of EBM if you freeze, say 300ml in one bottle if bub is only having 200ml a feed and only needs one feed

**xkwzit** · 18-12-2010 20:22

My LC suggested to wait until at least the 6 week mark before introducing a bottle. She also suggested that the long cylindrical teats were less likely to introduce confusion than orthodontic or cherry shaped ones.

It's not really possible to give an exact mls for each feed. I would just express and put that in a ziplock bag in the freezer and note how many mls on the outside. When it comes to making up a feed, you'll have to guess an amount and then defrost the right total mls. I would take the amount of milk I thought she'd need during the day out of the freezer and leave it in the fridge to defrost. I told mum that she'd take whatever packs of EBM to make up a feed (200 mls or whatever). When the time came, she'd warm the milk up with warm tap water and put it in the bottle. The ziplock bags are fine and they defrost quite quickly, esp if you can lay them down while they freeze so they are as thin as possible.

Cheers

**scarlett41** · 18-12-2010 20:56

I would avoid it before 6 weeks 1. because of teat/nipple confusion, 2. your breasts will be totally engorged if you express too much and 3 before then it takes an hour to breastfeed you need to feed every 2 hours so you don't really have time to express!!!

Like PP have said you can't predict how much for each feed. My son (7 months old still breastfed) sometimes has 80ml and sometimes has 250 mls. Your best bet is to freeze in small amounts (50ml) so you don't waste any. And if I'm having a night out I leave 4 (80 ml) bottles to avoid contamination-I ask the babysitter/DH/mum etc to use defrosted stuff first so I can freeze the fresh stuff if need be! Just remember too that a breastpump is nowhere near as effective as your baby. I got caught up in the trap of looking at mls and wondering if I was giving my baby enough but those little suckers can get a heap more than the pump-in fact some of my friends say they need to use 3 -4 expressed feeds to make up one feed for their bub-the same bub who is content after a breastfeed!
I go through stages, particularly when DS is not drinking so well-like at the moment he has a cold-so I express to keep my supply up and have about 1.5 litres in my freezer in small bags just from the last week. If DS is drinking fine I don't express-unless I'm going to be out for a feed and then I express before I go. But expressing is hard work-DS can have a 5 minute feed and be done but expressing can take half an hour, so I avoid it if I can.

Oh and just be careful which number teat whoever is doing the feed uses. I use the Avent bottles (and electric pump-love it) and the number 1 teat resembles to breast letdown the best. DH decided he didn't like the grumpy baby waiting for milk on number 1 so he got out the number 2 teat instead-the result? A very impatient grumpy baby when waiting for the breast letdown!
Good Luck!

**BigRedV** · 18-12-2010 21:04

I did it and it didn't ruin my bf relationship and was probably what kept me going. I used tommee tippee teets and bottles. I was expressing a lot in the beginning and was always leaking, but I wouldn't recommend it unless you have poor supply because expressing will increase your milk.

**BabyPaparazzi** · 19-12-2010 16:55

6 weeks until bubs and you learn and your routine is fully established and not to confuse bub, or let the start choose the easier option of the bottle. The problem giving EBM in the first few months is that it can be an extra effort for some people. If you give a bottle of ebm, you really are suppose to also express that feed as well at about the same time. If you don't and start missing feeds to often it can really affect your supply, as the demand is less. It is often a shortfall some woman make. A rule of thumb is to try and express the same amount that bubs takes from the bottle, ensuring your are continuing with the demand. From around 6 months your supply is generally starting to be pretty rock solid and you can skip without expressing occasionally.

EBM can be kept refrigerated for 5 days, so there is no need to freeze it if you will use it before then. The ABA has this information for expressing and storing and also reheating. http://www.breastfeeding.asn.au/bfinfo/express.html

I found it easier to store in the fridge in 50ml lots in glad bags, kept upright in a container. Start by offering the amount you might think they want, say 100ml, then if they finish this amount, add another 50 to the bottle and continue until they are done. If you find the ebm is coming up to 5 days, say on day 4, then you can freeze, and then use and defrost according to the guidelines. I've found mine to be random on volumes, sometimes its big, sometimes its small. The 150xbodyweight, divided by no.feeds rule is generally useful, but try to keep in mind that they can go over this, so we always leave plenty.

Pigeon bottles are often recommended by lc's for breastfed bubs.

**dancingtren** · 19-12-2010 17:51

i have expressed and given bottles since my son was only a few weeks old, it has not affected our breastfeeding relationship whatsoever, and it has been a godsend to me to be able to have some help from dh and to have a short time away from my son at times. i would express a little after the early and mid morning feed and add to it each day. like the other posters said just freeze small amounts so you dont waste any. also only keep small amounts in the bottle so when you give it to your bub you wont waste it. its easy to go and get another small amount from the fridge if they want more rather than starting with a big amount and then having to ditch what they dont want. yes it is more work as you still have to feed bub and then express too, but if you feel you need to share the load of feeding then do it! also i think it was already mentioned, but if you want to have your dh give a bottle you will need to express for that feed that you are missing. for example, my dh gives a bottle of EBM each night at 10pm, i express for that feed at 9pm.
good luck

**MilliesMumma** · 20-12-2010 06:55

Thanks for all the advice guys!

So if i freeze in small amount (50mls)
Whats the best way to defrost them?

and once they are defrosted how long can they stay in the fridge for?

Im about to buy a breast pump also, and i have tommee tippee bottles, has anyone used the tommee tippee manual and/or electric pump? Which is best?

**xkwzit** · 20-12-2010 07:25

I defrosted only on the day I needed them. I can't recall how long you can keep it (someone will know), but it's less than fresh EBM.

We defrosted with hot tap water, it doesn't take long. Or you could boil a kettle and use half cold, half hot. My DD1 actually didn't mind ice cold milk

Cheers