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[mamafelix]

Hi all

I just thought it would be nice to have a topic where we can discuss all the different ways of settling our babes that don't involve letting them cry it out. So on that note I propose a space where people will be positive about others suggestions and supportive of each others choices, whatever they may be.

I'm going to start a few threads with information on different techniques/schools of thought, if you know of any others please add them in.

I also thought we could have a thread with people's experiences of different age groups? since babies seem to go through different phases of sleep.. particularly I know the 4-5 month mark and the 7-9 month mark seem to be moments when they are particularly unsettled.

Feel free to share your stories- happy or not- this is not a forum where you will be judged on your choices as a parent. Everyone should know that every mum does her best given the information and support she has available at the time.

Maybe we also need a venting thread just for those sleepless nights/days when you feel like you're going crazy?! Maybe that should be an 'advice free zone' just a place to commiserate and understand that there are other mums going through the same thing.

But of course if anyone wants opinions or advice, just ask! I'm sure there's plenty of mums with supportive advice who would be willing to put in their 2 c.

[bubbalove]

Hi Zoe
Nice to have a balance in the forum, eh ;) I never co-slept with my son, but I never used CC either. He chose to start sleeping through the night at around 3.5 months, and has been doing so ever since. If he is ever sick, etc and wakes during the night, we go in and see if he's ok and settle him, and he's back off to sleep for the rest of the night. Now I know that this probably isn't the norm, but it's what happened with us, so it's all I can go by! I'm due with number 2 in a week, so I hope she's a great sleeper too :)
I theorise that my son's great night-time sleeping comes from having a routine, and from him knowing that if he really does need us, he only has to call out and we come straight to him, rather than letting him get himself really working up and wide awake before Mum or Dad come. Saying that however, we don't run in to every whimper. I hope this all makes sense!
I hope all the Mums and Dad's out there find a way to get bub and themselves some sleep at night in a way that they feel comfortable.

[willsmum]

Hi mamafelix,

We co-sleep with our first (he is 3 1/2) because he had reflux when he was little and just plain wouldn't settle without Mum & Dad, so for the sake of sanity we put him in with us. We tried controlled crying but he cried himself into hysterics and vomited every time we tried it.

Our little one (7 months) sleeps 8 - 12 hour stretches and drops off to sleep like an angel. I guess it's not what you do a lot of the time but depends on the nature of the child. Our two couldn't be more different.

[Trina]

Hi

Great idea for a discussion Mamfelix. My bub (now 9 months) has been sleeping through since the day he turned 3 months. That was the day we gave him a bottle of formula to complement his night time breast feed. We have never looked back. He now sleeps from 7.30 pm till 7.30 am or when either one of us gets up and he sees us.

Like bubbalove we never let him cry unnecessarily, on the other hand we don't jump at ever sound either. He's not a cryier anyway - I guess we are another one of the lucky one's.

[mamafelix]

Thanks for your replies guys!

It's great to hear all the different ways people deal with the whole sleep issue. I think it's true that each bub is different though, some do just seem to sleep easier and longer than others.
I'm hoping my second will be one of those who sleeps through from an early age... though to be honest I don't really care, but the thought of those early sleepless nights.. mm could do without it this time. Still I can't complain either, I have friends who had reflux babies- boy that's another thing altogether! Waking I can deal with, waking and screaming in pain- not much fun at all!

[Brontesmum]

Hi Ladies - Great idea. My baby is 3.5 months and has been sleeping through the night for about 5 weeks. Going down at 6.00pm (approx) and waking around 6:00am for which I am thankful. However chasing suggestions - fantastic she is sleeping like this and couldn't be happier, however wondering if there are any suggestions on putting her straight into the cot. I actually rock her to sleep and this has been a bad habit I have got into. It now seems that it is getting to every sleep she wants to be rocked - any suggestions I am more than happy to listen to. I have a wonderful baby who sleeps through the night and has about 3 sleeps a day (approx 1/2 hour to 1 hour) - but need to have her go off by herself. I am starting work in July again and dont really want her to be stressed at day care because no one is rocking her to sleep. Many thanks again. :)

[mamafelix]

Hi Brontesmum

wow, what a great baby! I hope it lasts for you.
To be frank, I always rocked or fed Felix to sleep, so I'm afraid I'm not going to be able to give you any personal experiences- except to say that when I went back to uni (he was 6 months) and he was being looked after by my mum, he fell asleep for her no problems at all- without needing the boob or to be rocked.

So in my experience it depends on who the carer is to an extent. The association of sleep and being rocked is probably linked to you as the person who does that- once she gets used to a new carer she'll also be used to their ways of putting her down.
The other thing you might want to consider is that some daycare centres are quite happy to rock/sling your baby if that is what you want. That might be one of the questions you want to ask prospective centres.

hth

[Brontesmum]

Many thanks for your suggestions and ideas. Will follow through. R Brontesmum (Sharon).

[Mumoffour]

our little bloke was always nursed/ cuddled to sleep from a young age or he went to sleep with me and hubby put him back in his bed when he came to bed. Hes now nearly two and sleeps really well in his own bed and we lie down with him and give him a cuddle until he falls asleep (roughly 15 min). :p Its a lovely chance for us to have a cuddle and he settles really easy. :) When he wakes up we also go straight in without letting him get worked up and he drops back to sleep almost immediatly (or after a drink of water). I cant bear leaving him to scream.

[Tea Lady]

Hi guys,

I was really pleased to see this discussion as I'm having trouble figuring out what to do with my 6 week old. So far I tend to feed her, talk/play etc and then cuddle her while she falls asleep. Mostly I'm happy with this, but I keep being told by nurses / other people who should know what they're talking about that this will mean they can't put themselves to sleep later on. After I get told this I usually have a few days of doubt about what I'm doing and I try to let her cry for a little while and then go back to rock/pat after a couple of minutes, but she gets really upset and I'm not strong willed enough to leave her crying again. Also, she doesn't even seem to realise that I'm rocking or patting her - she just gets even more upset and only calms down when I pick her up. Whenever anybody describes the technique of letting them cry and then going back to them it always seems to involve calming them down without picking them up, but it has never worked for me (not that I've tried too hard I guess). Also, I would like to know if anyone is aware WHY people say they won't be able to sleep by themselves later on - I mean is there any research that proves this or what? My little girl is happy for most of the day and doesn't usually cry much so I don't really want to start introducing a reason for her to cry alot.

What do you think?

L

[mamafelix]

Hi LuWa

tell you what- if you're happy with how your baby falls asleep then I wouldn't listen to a thing anyone else says. They don't know your child. You do. Trust your own instincts.
If you ever feel unhappy about her sleeping then you might want to look for advice.

Personally I think that most child health nurses do a great job of undermining mum's confidence in their own abilities, certainly that was my experience. I too was totally happy with the way I was parenting- which for me was feeding Felix to sleep and co-sleeping, but that wasn't acceptable to the nurse, and many others.

Luckily I found a lot of support from people who do similar things so I was able to shrug off the comments, and guess what? Sleeping has never been an issue for me with Felix. Sure, we've had rough patches of little sleep- but once I accepted this as normal, and having the support around me was critical at these times- I found that they always passed pretty quickly. Teething and developmental milestones will do it everytime- and from what I've heard it happens to most babies even if you've done CC or whatever from an early age.

As for them learning to sleep on their own- really this will happen. I won't promise that it will happen by a certain age- because they are all so different.
You may come to a point where for your own sanity you might want to encourage her towards this in some way- but that is your decision and anyone elses opinions shouldn't matter.


okay- stepping off the soapbox now... :o

[alicesmum]

I have tried a bit of CC, but patting definitely doesn't work for my 7 mth old.
So, I always pick her up if she won't settle (i can only bear a few minutes of crying!), re-wrap her on the bed (nice and tight, arms down, in a *big* cotton cot sheet folded in half) and she finds the cuddle and attention associated with being re-wrapped very soothing. The most number of times I have ever had to re-wrap her before it has worked is twice. Works everytime for us!!

Also, bought one of those musical aquariums from K-Mart that strap onto the side of the cot which have little fish and lights and lullabies and whenever I turn on a tune, she knows now that it's sleepy time.

Good luck!

[vonniemason]

hi guys,

I have a 25mth old boy cameron, i have been having problems with him sleeping in his own bed since he was around 8 months of age, now and then i will put him to bed and he will sleep right through and other nights he is in there for 3 to 4 hours then wants to jump into bed with us. is there any mums out there that has gone through this very frustrating experience and could you maybe give me some advice on some changes that might help. Also Is he too old to be having naps during the day? As :confused: this is my first child and i know every child is different but as you can imagine he is two driving me batty and dont know what to do.

:p

[Hukuna Matata]

Sure, we've had rough patches of little sleep- but once I accepted this as normal, and having the support around me was critical at these times- I found that they always passed pretty quickly. Teething and developmental milestones will do it everytime-

okay- stepping off the soapbox now... :o

Please don't get of the soapbox. It was these kinds of comments in other forums that helped me get through the bad days (like those times around the milestones - waking every hour is not fun!).

My 6 months old son has never slept through. My beautiful son has sooo many strong points, but alas sleeping is not one of them.

You know what... I don't care (well some days I do, but that's after a really bad night). He needs me, day and night and that's OK. He is so busy looking at things and playing during the day, and he is alway distracted during feeds, so if at night he gets some good feeds, then great.... However, we cosleep, so it is a matter of popping out a boob and going back to sleep....

It can take us ages to get ds to sleep. He often needs to be sung to and walked/rocked to get to sleep. Again, I'll take the glass half full view on this one. He is not going to be a baby forever. He is not always going to need us to help him get to sleep. I am going to treasure these moments while I can(see, hakuna matata ;) )

I feel that co-sleeping has been a big help. I read somewhere that baby's who co-sleep wake twice as often as those who don't HOWEVER mothers who co-sleep get at least as much sleep as those how don't (due to them not fully waking in the first place).

Mind you, I have read the "no cry sleep solution" and try to do a lot of the thing mentioned in there to encourage my ds to sleep better. But I don't get too pandantic about it

Some days I do get down :( , and wish he would sleep better, but if I think about the above, I get through.... :)

[mamafelix]

Hi vonniemason

hmm well Felix still mainly has day sleeps, but sometimes he doesn't. Most of his friends of the same age still have them too, if that helps?

Felix has just decided that he wants to have his own 'big boy bed' but we have it in the same room as us so we're pretty felxible about where he ends up sleeping. Most nights he sleeps there by himself but sometimes he asks me to come in with him for a while- which is fine until I get really big with this pregnancy I guess.
How about putting a single mattrass down next to your bed (if it fits?) then your little boy might feel a bit happier in his own bed? I find that some nights Felix will call out 'mum' and if I answer, will go straight back to sleep.

We also made the whole 'big boy bed' something really exciting, got a new night light, sheets, star canopy from IKEA.. can you make his bed somewhere he REALLY wants to be?

[osmum]

Hi Hakuna Matata,

I am mum to a 6 month old called Owen who does not sleep through the night either! He is also very active and busy during the day and I know for a fact that his day feeds are very small since I have partially weaned and can see how much formula he is taking. He does huge feeds at night to compensate. Like you, some days I feel very tired and wonder how much longer I can put up with it, but generally I just accept it and get on with enjoying my wonderful son. I have been to Tresillian, talked to my childhood nurse etc. but no-one has come up with any solutions for switching his feeding patterns. We do try re-settling, which works sometimes but generally he is just plain hungry.

While lots of people have babies who sleep through the night by this age, I also know many who are still feeding at night up to 9 months of age. Hopefully when he is on three solids a day he will no longer want to feed at night... but I'm not getting my hopes up too much...

Jo

:)

[Hukuna Matata]

Jo,

I think relalistic expectations are a good thing to have. It ensures that we don't get disappointed.... I like your attitude about enjoying your time with your son, this is how I look at things and it makes night time parenting a lot easier!

I don't think the sleeping has anything to do with the name Owen. By the way, fabulous choice :D

[Graeme]

Hi

I like this thread - very encouraging

Our very nearly 17 month has recently started waking in the middle of the night some time. It started when we left a light on in the living room because our 4 years old has finally decided it is time not to wear nappies. (That isn't working too well either, but thats a whole nother story :confused: ) Last night Alexa woke at about 3.00, and because I was still thinking in terms of making sure she can settle herself, she cried on an off for about 1 1/2 hours.

I got up to her a number of times and would cuddle her for a while and calm her down. When I put her down she would start again. I think I was still worrying about being too easy and us having problems for ages. But it is a recent occurance and she is normally a good sleeper, so I think I might chill out a bit :) .

Its been good to read this thread. She normally does sleep until at least 5 and then has a feed (breast fed so clearly not from me) and goes back to sleep (if it is early) until somewhere between 6 and 7.30. (Daylight saving has just stopped here so that might all change).

Knowing that she does normally sleep well, you folk have reminded me that I can rock her back to sleep and that she won't turn into a monster who never goes to sleep by herself :p

Thanks for the reassurance.
Sleep well!!
Graeme

[Hukuna Matata]

she is normally a good sleeper, so I think I might chill out a bit :) .
Graeme

Nice to have a dad on board.... (Glad to see that you know that you aren't the one that breastfeeds ;) )

I love this kind of attitude, it make parenting easier and less stressful.

Maybe it is just a period of adjustment and will settle down soon. But in the mean time, isn't it nice to think that when your daughter needs someone to help, you can give her just what she needs :)

Good sleep to all!!!!

[WeThree]

I think some people make to big of an issue out of all of this stuff and that is why i was glad to see this thread, if something works for you and your baby, then do it. I think the best thing is to be relaxed and if you slighty follow your babies lead you are usually able to work out a routine. Every baby is different and what works great for one is not going to work for another. Babies were made to be cuddled and loved, whats the point of having them if they are just going to be left alone to scream all the time! My 4 mth old had been sleeping through the night for quite some time now however the last few nights she has started waking up twice for a feed, I just assume that she is going through a growth spurt and dont make an issue of it, besides i think its lovely to have my darling daughter in my bed for a cuddle and a feed and then to see her drift back into a deep and contented sleep, she is a noisy drinker ( like most woman i seem to have more milk at night and she slurps alot!) & my husband & I enjoy hearing all those cute funny noises in the middle of the night.
Anyway I think all of us should trust in our instincts as mothers/fathers more and not get so hung up on what other people say or think as im sure the majority of us are doing a great job! :p

[Kat]

Hi, I wanted to especially write back to LuWa on a couple of things she raised..not that I'm the expert with just one 5 month old daughter.

Dr's nurses etc don't have to live at your house - you are the one who has to be happy with your daughter's routine and the way you deal with sleeping, they don't. Thats my motto. I too got told all sorts of stuff by experts, and the stuff that disagreed with my gut instinct usually turned out to be wrong.

One thing a psychologist did tell the mother's group that I attended that I thought was very interesting was that it doesn't matter what you choose to do to settle your baby as long as when you decide to change it (say you choose to do the crying thing) that you don't stop and start - he pointed out very logically that if you try controlled settling twice but then gave up and then rocked to sleep that the bub gets all kinds of messed up messages (including - if I kick up enough of a stink i get what I want) - which isn't what we want to teach them, hey?

The theory on why they won't be able to settle later on is based loosely on the concept of learning to 'self settle' as a whole - e.g. being able to recognise that they're tired and need sleep and to soothe themselves rathr than needing a outside person for comfort. Which is technically a highly desirable characteristic for them when they are older - and the 'experts' say that it starts at birth being able to be self-reliant for comfort to sleep. In reality I don't know what positive I'm teaching my baby by ignoring her when she wakes up with a wet bottom or hungry - then again I have a wonderful baby who doesn't cry for no reason - she always has a reason though sometimes it is hard to work out!

I hope that perspective helps.

Kat


Hi guys,

I was really pleased to see this discussion as I'm having trouble figuring out what to do with my 6 week old. So far I tend to feed her, talk/play etc and then cuddle her while she falls asleep. Mostly I'm happy with this, but I keep being told by nurses / other people who should know what they're talking about that this will mean they can't put themselves to sleep later on.

After I get told this I usually have a few days of doubt about what I'm doing and I try to let her cry for a little while and then go back to rock/pat after a couple of minutes, but she gets really upset and I'm not strong willed enough to leave her crying again. Also, she doesn't even seem to realise that I'm rocking or patting her - she just gets even more upset and only calms down when I pick her up. Whenever anybody describes the technique of letting them cry and then going back to them it always seems to involve calming them down without picking them up, but it has never worked for me (not that I've tried too hard I guess). Also, I would like to know if anyone is aware WHY people say they won't be able to sleep by themselves later on - I mean is there any research that proves this or what? My little girl is happy for most of the day and doesn't usually cry much so I don't really want to start introducing a reason for her to cry alot.

What do you think?

L

[Kat]

Please don't get of the soapbox. It was these kinds of comments in other forums that helped me get through the bad days (like those times around the milestones - waking every hour is not fun!).

He needs me, day and night and that's OK. He is so busy looking at things and playing during the day, and he is alway distracted during feeds, so if at night he gets some good feeds, then great.... However, we cosleep, so it is a matter of popping out a boob and going back to sleep....
)

I can so relate to what you are saying about the distractions etc - Phoebe is 5 months so perhaps this is a development thing - its funny but I would prefer she got over the distracted thing and did feed better during the day. I miss my uninterrupted night snoozes she used to spoil me with!

Has anyone else experienced a distracted day-time baby?

Kat

[our little treasures]

What a great thread, my dd is now nearly 15mnths and we still co sleep with her. She had really bad reflux and cryed all the time, my mum has five of us and she said she had never seen a baby scream so much. DD would never settle on her own and we always rocked her to sleep, the nurses booked me into the queen elizabeth centre for a day stay as they said its not good for her etc. Well she went to sleep there after 20mins of screaming I was a nervous reck and my dh was unsettled, well we got home and I was left to do it and I gave up.

Yes I did the best thing for us I picked her up and cryed and said I would never do it again. We don't have to rock her anymore we just lay together on the bed for between 2-10 mins and cuddle. Bed time mostly is a happy place and when I say lets go to bed my dd heads of to the bed. Having b/f dd didnt sleep thru til 10mnths, my mum has looked after her once and i fretted about leaving her (mum likes cc) but dd went to sleep in mums arms on the couch. My hubby and I get sad when we think of her big girls room we are decorating as we will miss her rolling over and hugging us. :(

I'm due in july with #2 and this time I will mother by my instincts, even if there is four in the bed. :)

[Alsmum]

Hi all
It is so refreshing and comforting to hear your stories as they sound so much like what I have been going through - that is, listening too much to the so called experts and others.

This time with our beautiful babies is so precious, why waste it listening to them scream themselves into a frenzy. I cannot bear doing this having tried it. My bb was going to sleep on his own during the day for about a month at 3 months of age but now has trouble doing this. As he sleeps 11-12 hours at night I figure that I just have to relax and deal with the daytime sleep issues in whatever way works as he probably doesn't need as much sleep anymore. (now 5 months)

Thank you all for your "pearls of wisdom"

Alsmum

[Peta H]

Hi All

My son is 13 months today! Yay! He has never been one to sleep through the night. Everyone keeps telling me to let him cry it out and let him learn on his own. In my sleep deprived state I keep hoping that he will learn how to fall asleep without me and without crying for ages. I am the first to admit I am a wimp with extended crying. Has anyone had success with action oriented little boys?