SleepFighter

[catnapjack]

Ive been staying calm but things are getting a little out of control. :eek:

My boy has morphed into a sleep fighter. I have always had issues with settling him and spent 2 weeks at Torrens House (likeTressilion) to get a routine and the settling caper under control. He was an angel there and I was feeling guilty by the end of the stay that I was imagining things :o

I respect the Child and Youth health nurse opinions but I really need to hear from real mums, what do you do to settle your bub?

I am looking for a consistent approach as he thrives on routine (when does that come back?) and consistency. Currently I wrap him (not successful with the weaning :o ) put dummy in and push his cot back and forwards ( I had DH install wheels and melamine under the wheels ) This worked relatively well until 2 weeks ago. I was hoping it was a phase but I can spend anything up to an hour trying to settle him before he drifts off. The fact that his day sleeps are so brief means that I am going through this exhausting process up to 6 times a day :eek:

What are you all doing out there ? P.S he is nearly 5 months old

[BJelly]

Hi,

I don't really have any suggestions, my bub went through a similar thing at 5 months - she became much more aware of the world around her, and she found it very difficult to wind down - I know your pain - it would take me an hour or two to get her to sleep for even 30 mins - sooo frustrating.

I ended up going to a day hospital place and they got me to cut down on the breast feeds (I was doing it 2-3 hourly), and do CC. It worked well for us, until she started to get mobile in the cot a few months later - she kind of freaked herself out by doing that I think. But we are getting back into a better sleep routine now.

[catnapjack]

Thanks Bjelly, Im thinking once he hits 6 months I may have to do the whole CC thing as sleep has become such an issue.

Does anyone have a settling routine?

[Rainbowbrite]

SInce i stopped wrapping MJ all I do is put her in the cot with her dummy & her stuffed turtle & 9 times out of 10 she plays until she dozes off.

RB

[catnapjack]

I might try that today for curiousity sake but I have a bad feeling already. He is such a monkey....at 5 months he already projectile spits his dummy then crys until I replace it. He is way too young to replace it himself (kind of funny watching him try though ) :D

[Snugglepot]

Hi CatnapJack,

DS also just went through a stage of finding it hard to get to sleep. I found that it was partly due to his 4 month shots, they can just put a baby a bit off kilter and sleep is usually the first thing to be affected. I also stopped wrapping DS around the same time (after 3 weeks of one arm in one out and changing the pattern I went cold turkey) It took about 2 weeks to re settle him into a pattern of going to sleep by himself again.

The most important thing is his tired signs, they are getting older now and it is a bit harder to get it right sometimes. DS starts to rub his eyes and whinge a little, as soon as I see that, it is time for bed and we do our usual song, kiss etc... I usually leave him for a couple of minutes or I wait until he is crying, not whinging. If he is whinging I figure he is just trying to get himself off to sleep. If he is crying I go in and rub his head and Ssshhh. The sshh is the best thing, sometimes I will sit on the florr and sshh for 5 minutes. I also give himn his dummy at this stage and that is often what he wants and off he goes. (he only has the dummy for day sleeps at night I would just rub his head and shhh him) I will continue to go in everytime he gets worked up until he goes off (once again not whinging only when he is crying) It is persistance and consistancy with this method that finally got him back into his good sleeping pattern.

DS is also a catnapper, a habit left over from his reflux days (this is better now, yippee!) I am finding that although I can not make him sleep longer, he is sometimes doing it himself now. I always leave him in his cot when he wakes up for the full 1.5 hours I want him to ideally be sleeping for naps. I will either leave him chatting to himself or go in a open the curtains and turn on his mobile, give him a toy, whatever. The main idea is that he enjoys his cot and room and is happy to hang out in there. I think he has slept for 2 hours about 10 times now, so things are on the up for us there!

The funniest thing for me was when I started telling DS that he was so lucky to be going to sleep in such a nice room, he started to like it more! I also say to him, have a nice nap I will see you in 2 hours etc...Kids hey, perhaps they take on heaps more than we think.

[catnapjack]

Thankyou. Jack has always been an unsettled baby, but really difficult at the moment. I also do the shooshing and stroke his head (esp at night when I dont get into the cot rocking thing) Hit and miss.

I have also noticed he cant get enough sleep. Seems like he is constantly grizzling and clenching his fists, even after waking (even in the am too after his biggish sleep) Although I must admit he has gone from a 10hour a night sleeper to sleeping from 8 til 4 then is up every hour for dummy or resettling. This may be making me more tired too though and maybe affecting his daytime settling :confused:

[Snugglepot]

Kyle is also grumpy not long after waking up from a catnap. I have to put him in his chair with the vibrator on, a sheet over the chair, a sheet in his hands to fiddle with and the dummy. He then calms down and hangs out and has a nap before his bottle. They really need the longer sleeps at this age I think. Jack may be tired when he gets up because he has not slept much from 4am. He is 4.5 months now, perhaps you could start him on baby rice for a couple of weeks. I know it is not the done thing to start before 6 months, but he may be ready, he is waking earlier than normal. Rice is low allergenic and if you stuck to just that for a while it may help him sleep longer day and night. Quite a few of my Mothers group mums have started their babies at 4.5 and 5 months and it has helped thier bubs sleep longer at night again.

We are told a million things to do and not to do and really I think it is about been informed and gut instinct. Stick with it, I am sure he will start to nap longer soon, that is the age Kyle started. Stay consistant and make his cot a good place to be.

[catnapjack]

Thankyou so much for your advice. I have only just tried the rice cereal thing so he is only getting a tiny bit. Im glad to be reassured that it is hypoallergenic as he has a dairy intolerance therefore possibly susceptible to other food allergies at the moment.

This morning has started dreadful again ! I honestly cant understand this refusal to fall asleep. He isnt overtired as he has only been up for 1 and a half hours.

I have a confession to make too :o I have put glycerine on his dummy to help prevent him spitting it out. It works, but maybe this is why he is now calling out for dummy in the night and interupting his solid sleep? Should I stop?

Could this be a growth spurt thing needing all this extra sleep yet refusing to succumb? :confused:

[Snugglepot]

I would probably stop the glycerine on the dummy as it is not too good for for their teeth in the future. It could be a growth spurt, but if he has always been a bad sleeper then maybe not. If things are pretty bad already why not stop the dummy at night and the wrapping all at once and spend the next week teaching him to sleep without any props at all...eeek! Could be an awful week, but things may improve then. As you increase the rice, that should help too.

A good book is the baby whisperer for common sense no controlled crying techniques. Good luck and keep persisting

[catnapjack]

Thanks Kez, I'll talk to DH about the no props approach so he can be at the ready to help. First though, Im going to buy that book you mentioned as I have seen lots of people talk about it so its worth a try. Thanks again :)

[Michelle_N]

Hi Catnapjack,

I swear you have written this about my son also named Jack and born in July!! I also have a thread in this topic called "Why doesnt he like to sleep during the day?".

My little man only has 30 min sleeps during the day (about 4 of them) which I struggle and struggle to get him to sleep. It can take me anywhere from 5 mins to half an hour of him crying and me getting upset before he sleeps. At night he sleeps well which I am eternally grateful for.

It is getting better now as I have accepted I have a catnapper (please see my post as it has a lot of helpful comments from other mums) and I dont get as stressed if he doesnt peacefully fall asleep. And I have also accepted the fact that its only ever going to be for 30mins. I dont try anymore to out him back to sleep as he just wont do it and it upsets us both even more.

As for how I put him to sleep (I dont use a dummy) but I rock him in my arms till he drifts off and then put him in his cot. If he wakes up again and cries I pick him up and do it again. I personally cannot stand to see him cry and simply cant do CC. I know all the sleep clinics, etc say not to let them fall asleep in your arms and not to let them fall asleep on the breast but hey, it works for me and Jack seems so much more happier as we arent struggling anymore to fit into the "sleeping guidelines". It used to really upset me when my health nurse would accuse me of not letting Jack get his 1.5 to 2 hours sleep during the day. But now, particularly after reading here at bubhub about so other mums that have sleep problems, I feel so much better because its nothing I am doign wrong, its just the way he is.

Have a look at this website - http://www.askdrsears.com/html/7/T070100.asp as it has a lot of good info about sleeping, etc.

And only as its my personal opinion about no CC please have a look at this article too. It just made so much sense to me - http://www.askdrsears.com/html/5/T051200.asp#T051205

Dont worry and please take heart as this wont go on forever. I mean by the time he is 18 years old surely I still wont be rocking him to sleep....right? :)

Michelle

[catnapjack]

Thankyou Michelle :)

Things are horrific at the moment here in my house so I have decided to take him to the Doctor to have him checked over as he looks sad (normally smiles all the time despite adversities) and lethargic. At first I thought it might be developmental normal things but I think this is his first real "sickie" (other than his dairy intolerance, reflux etc) :(

Appointment this afternoon. If he gives the all clear then it is possibly his reflux back to its old tricks as he has been showing some sneaky signs of that getting bad again.

Your little Jack looks gorgeous! So he is a catnapjack too ;)

[Snugglepot]

Hi Nicole,

How are things going with Jack? Any better sleeps yet? I hope things went well at the doctors. :)

[Mrs Little]

i am only a new mum. But i have found that having a consistant routine of feed/ wake/ sleep cycles really helps. I also use control crying, but have been since we brought him home from hospital.

My son is 11 weeks old now and he very rarely needs to cry himself to sleep.....he has learnt to settle himself. I also give him a dummy....and try not to give it to him again if he does wake up out of a sleep...i let him cry for 3 mins ( a chance to resettle himself) and then i go in and calm him without the dummy if i can.

Have some settle time with him- wrapped or unwrapped- where u talk quietly in his room, hug him and settle him. Just make sure you always put him down in the cot with his eyes open. Give yourself a time limit. We set 10 minutes of crying before we went in. Wait for a lull between cries before you go in...so he learns that you wont come to a cry. After the 10 min one....do every 3mins. It take 3 to 4 days to break old habits...so be paitent.

My son has been on a 3 hour routine since we came home. I am just starting to push him to a 3 1/2 hr routine. But he has been sleeping through from the late night feed at 10pm till 7am since he was about 7 weeks.

Hope this helps.
Mrs Little & Son.

[BecH]

The articles Michelle included make amazing sense. I have a little girl a lot like the Jack's described.

Here is some techniques i use to totally avoid controlled crying, because in instances it has been shown to affect brain development (I am an educator with a special interest in thisw research, and my husband is a Doctor) but saying that I understand geting to the point where you feel nothing else will work (most days at 5pm, lol).

- bouncing with bub on an exercise ball
- rocking chair with bub facing outwards
- continual shhh sound
- only trying to put her to sleep once she has settled into a position where she isn't worked up or crying.
- sling
- battery operated swing with music
- singing,
-walking with bub looking over my shoulder

Ruby settles much better during the day with background noise I think it gives her security. Anyway best of luck it isn't mush fun when you don't feel you cna help them.

DH 6-11-82
Me 8-3-82
Ruby Grace 27-8-05