View Full Version : Did you 'give birth'
:yelclap: Thanks everyone for a great discussion on changing the term "caesarean section" to include the word "birth"
The 'abdominal birth' (http://bubhub.com.au/community/forums/showthread.php?t=56907)thread has given rise, for me, to a new topic of discussion - Do you consider yourself to have given birth?
Thanks everyone, in advance, for contributing.
No where in my day to day life could I possibley have the opportunity to gain a miriad of perspective and BubHub is a wonderful place to afford us that opportunity :yes: that I think we all agree on:D
Also thank YOU all, with your variety of opinions, for helping me feel a little less alienated from the world, everytime I log on here. :)
Motherhood can be so isolating, eh?................
That's a good question Nats. I guess I don;t usually say that I 'gave birth' rather that 'I had a baby' if that makes sense.
I had a very positive elective c-section and wouldn't change anything about it, but I personally do not think that I didn't 'give birth'
However - I did bring a beautiful, happy and healthy child into this world and I am very proud of the fact I could do that.
bronny-jane
21-12-2006, 10:36
Motherhood can be so isolating, eh?................
:D maybe its just you nats...not motherhood:p
borntobemummy
21-12-2006, 10:39
I feel like I was robbed of the opportunity to "give birth" I say they took her out of me, she didn't want to come out, so they had to cut her out. Sad, I know, I still have a lot of healing to do:o
:D maybe its just you nats...not motherhood:p
Cheeky girl :shame: :D
I am indifferent I had an emergency c/section it's birth I say when I gave birth I say when I had Eliza whatever she was born lol
I would have felt a bit better about the whole event if my childs birth hadn't been turned into a surgical procedure
Once they made my husband and baby leave they just ignored me no matter how I implored them to talk to me.
They weren't sharing in the most marvelous day of my life! I was just a body on a table.
It would've made things easier if they'd drop that divider that prevented me from seeing my boy at the same moment my husband did.
oleander
21-12-2006, 11:25
I feel tht I 'gave birth'. My baby was 'born' wasn't she?
I would have felt a bit better about the whole event if my childs birth hadn't been turned into a surgical procedure
Once they made my husband and baby leave they just ignored me no matter how I implored them to talk to me.
They weren't sharing in the most marvelous day of my life! I was just a body on a table.
It would've made things easier if they'd drop that divider that prevented me from seeing my boy at the same moment my husband did.
This was my experience...:yes:
I have never felt more irrelevant and dirty in my life....
this is how I interpret what they did to me during my 2nd c/sec:
'she's a failure, she cant do it herself, lets cut her out of the picture as much as we can, and do it ourselves'
It's like I was a giant life threatening cancer to my child. I no longer was his mother, I was merely a threat that they had to surgically remove from him, and once my child was no longer threatened, they whisked him away from me. I then pretty much ceased to exist, apart from the fact that they were obliged to keep my heart beating, so they could make their claim of a 'healthy outcome'.
I didn't birth my baby - I was just a carrier:(
Mamaduke
21-12-2006, 12:02
nats...
you should make the poll multiple choice for those of us, like me, who've had both emergency & elective c/sections.
I am 100% positive that I gave birth to my sons.
I think this is bringing up interesting issues surrounding the caesarean procedure itself, and is nothing to with us mummas.
It is up to the careprovider to ensure that the mother is still viewed as the 'birthing mother', and helped to birth her baby during the c/section as much as possible.
If I had have needed another c/sec, I would have tried to negotiate pulling the baby out of myself, or at least being able to watch my baby emerge from my body, negotiated the cord remaining attached until they removed the placenta, lotus style (bubs lying on my naked chest, so this shouldnt hypothetically be a big deal). I think this would have made a huge difference in how I viewed my children's 'births' via c/sec.
We shouldnt let these discussions end up with us beating one another up. It is an emotional issue, and neither sides are wrong or right, because birth is an 'experience' and experiences have a subjective level, as well as an objective level.
On an objective level, c/section is the surgical extraction of a baby from a woman's abdomen.
On a subjective level, a c/section can be interpreted as anything you feel is right for you.....
If a surgeon gave us a c/sec experience that was beautiful, then that is great.
If a surgeon gave us a c/sec experience which was horrific, then that is scandalous, and shouldnt be allowed.
I'm a scaredy cat so the thought of actually giving birth has always frightened the hell out of me...i was glad my ob said i had no choice but to hav 2 c-sections.
I just say i had two babies...dont really considered it "giving birth". I just layed there drugged up and the doctor just handed her over..but for me...i was happy with that...
....its whatever u perceive it to be.....
I have said my piece in the other thread, so will just leave it at yes - I did give birth to both of my babies, one v/b, one c/s.
hell yes i gave birth. the part of the baby coming out of the vagina is only a small part of the birthing process. i created and made therefore i gave birth.
hell yes i gave birth. the part of the baby coming out of the vagina is only a small part of the birthing process. i created and made therefore i gave birth.
it doesnt feel like just a small part.....:laughing:
you make it sound simple.... like the baby just walks out through a vaginal door....
the vaginal birthing part is the hardest part of the birthing journey, the bit where you do the most work....I felt it was the hardest work I've ever done in my life!
Your body reaches the Mount Everest of physiological acheivement, when you push that baby out of your vagina.....
any woman who has experienced both, can tell you now, the part where you push your baby out through your vagina, feels like an eternity when you are doing it, and in that lala-labour-land, where time stands still, it can feel longer than your entire pregnancy and labour put together....
RedPanda
21-12-2006, 13:38
it doesnt feel like just a small part.....:laughing:
It sure doesn't !!! :eek: :laughing:
I had a VB, but if I am telling someone of a friend's birth (via C/S), I naturally just say "gave birth".
it doesnt feel like just a small part.....:laughing:
you make it sound simple.... like the baby just walks out through a vaginal door....
the vaginal birthing part is the hardest part of the birthing journey, the bit where you do the most work....I felt it was the hardest work I've ever done in my life!
Your body reaches the Mount Everest of physiological acheivement, when you push that baby out of your vagina.....
any woman who has experienced both, can tell you now, the part where you push your baby out through your vagina, feels like an eternity when you are doing it, and in that lala-labour-land, where time stands still, it can feel longer than your entire pregnancy and labour put together....
i beg to differ... i have had a friend deliver in 20 mins she claimed nothing more than a small tummy ache. now wen i was laying on a hospital bed blood oozing down my legs at 18 weeks. that was the worse for me. im not saying vb is a walk in the park but to dismiss the 9 months before hand saying well you didnt deliver vb how would you know anything is a bit of a slap in the face
it doesnt feel like just a small part.....:laughing:
you make it sound simple.... like the baby just walks out through a vaginal door....
the vaginal birthing part is the hardest part of the birthing journey, the bit where you do the most work....I felt it was the hardest work I've ever done in my life!
Your body reaches the Mount Everest of physiological acheivement, when you push that baby out of your vagina.....
any woman who has experienced both, can tell you now, the part where you push your baby out through your vagina, feels like an eternity when you are doing it, and in that lala-labour-land, where time stands still, it can feel longer than your entire pregnancy and labour put together....
Any woman? ;)
I must have been swearing too much to notice time standing still. I do remember the rather foul feeling of DD being half in, half out though.
I didn't have a sense of achievement after my v/b - i had a sense of relief, same as when they put my DS on my chest after my c/s - relief that they were out and okay.
I dont remember the half-in half-out feeling as foul....I guess it is down to perception...
it bl00dy hurt, but it was still awesome. I had 2 rings of fire due to mild shoulder dystocia....I had a couple of minutes between head-shoulders-hips. I felt his head inside of me, and felt it as I guided him of me with my pushes. I remember him wriggling as he was turning inside my vagina....wow, it hurt at the time.....
but I am in awe of myself that i did it by myself.
I guess because I can make the comparison between someone else doing it for me, and me doing it myself.
That is the difference I am talking about.
during my vag births, it was just me an bubs doing the work. during my c/secs, it was the surgeon doing all the work.
We are not talking about pregancy and labour here. Surely the topic is about the 'exit' used by the baby???
The moment of 'birth' is the moment where the baby comes out of your body. Labour and pregancy are not 'birth'. Nothing is 'out' during labour and pregancy.
1. Pregnancy is about the baby being inside and growing.
2. Labour is about the body opening up for the baby to exit.
3. Birth is the actual exit.
3 totally different things.
That is the impression I got from the OP anyway.....
I dont remember the half-in half-out feeling as foul....I guess it is down to perception........
Perception - I think we finally agree on soemthing :eek:
You enjoyed (as much as you can ;) )your v/b's, and are angry about your c/s'
I enjoyed neither, and am angry about neither.
I view them both as birth - I feel pretty neutral about both of them.
jess_live_die
21-12-2006, 14:25
i gave birth to both my daughters natural but i think even if you have a c/s you are still giving birth its just a different way of giving birth.
I know someone who gave birth vaginaly unconcious. She passed out but her body kept doing its thing and the baby was in no distress and everything progressed perfectly so they let it happen. She didn't 'experience' half her labour or her birth, she just went into labour and woke up with a baby! She sure as anything didn't get the "Mount Everest of physiological acheivement"!
Dosen't mean she didn't 'give birth', dosen't make her birth less of one than anyone elses, and she is quite happy to say she gave birth.
I was awake for my c/s, I saw him come out, I felt him come out, I held him straight away and I am also more than happy to say i gave birth.
Briannabear
21-12-2006, 14:50
I didnt vote because I needed two options.
Ive had one planned c/s and one emergency one - But I like to think that I still gave birth.
I carried my babies for 9 months - felt every flutter and kick. I had a labour with my first baby - and preparation for my second. I felt my babies be born. I heard their first cry as they came into the world. I had the long recovery back to normal afterwards. I bear the scar and stretch marks on my belly as 'battle scars' ..... and Im damn proud of it!! :yes:
(I must say though - my outlook on my births has changed a lot since my second baby - being a much more positive birth)
I know someone who gave birth vaginaly unconcious. She passed out but her body kept doing its thing and the baby was in no distress and everything progressed perfectly so they let it happen. She didn't 'experience' half her labour or her birth, she just went into labour and woke up with a baby! She sure as anything didn't get the "Mount Everest of physiological acheivement"!
Dosen't mean she didn't 'give birth', dosen't make her birth less of one than anyone elses, and she is quite happy to say she gave birth.
I was awake for my c/s, I saw him come out, I felt him come out, I held him straight away and I am also more than happy to say i gave birth.
I dont disagree with your feelings....
you dont need to be concious to give birth yourself...in fact the less use of the neocortex the better...:laughing:
nobody helped extract your friends baby from her body, her body did it by itself....she therefore birthed her own baby. no argument there.....
nats...
you should make the poll multiple choice for those of us, like me, who've had both emergency & elective c/sections.
:wizard: consider it done :)
:wizard: consider it done :)
Hmm, maybe not, seems I've out smarted myself...
Maybe you could just vote twice then :confused:
The point I was making was IMHO it dosen't matter if you go cs or vb, the woman has little control over the proceedings. As much as vb mums would like to think 'I did it!' it dosen't matter if you make a concious effort or not your body takes over and that baby will be born wether you like it or not.
You're just along for the ride, much the same way as a c/s mum is.
The point I was making was IMHO it dosen't matter if you go cs or vb, the woman has little control over the proceedings. As much as vb mums would like to think 'I did it!' it dosen't matter if you make a concious effort or not your body takes over and that baby will be born wether you like it or not.
You're just along for the ride, much the same way as a c/s mum is.
I dont agree.
The story of your friend just proves that our bodies are designed to do this, most of the time (i know, i know, rarely it doesnt do this). Her body went with it's instincts.
I was a partner in my sons birth this year. I moved around, swayed, changed positions, pushed etc to help get him out. I wasnt concious, I was instinctive. Being concious is what stalled me. Being instinctive (letting my monkey do it) is what eventually birthed him.
You dont need to use your instincts in an operating theatre. It is the surgeons instincts that you are seriously praying are correct.
SilverStarfish
21-12-2006, 17:58
I had a c/section and I ABSOLUTELY gave birth to her :yes:
I need the multi choice too:D (you can't vote twice)
In both instances I gave birth to my babies - it's how I'm at peace with their births. I think if I worried too much about whether it was a complete experience or not (ie whether I gave birth or my baby was taken from me), then I'll be forever wrestling with something I have no control over changing. I would love to experience a VB and sometimes wonder if that is a major reason as to why I'm unsure whether our family is finished or not. It's not a very good reason to have another child though.
I had positive experiences with both of my children's births and continue to view them that way - it's the best way I know to move on. I feel sorry for my hubby - he will never experience feeling a baby inside of him let alone a birth. How could I be upset about how my children were birthed when another major person in their lives will never get to experience even half of what I have.
I still think it comes back to my previous post on where do you draw the line?
A woman who needs ventouse or forceps technicaly didn't 'give birth' to her child either, under your definition the medical personel did it.
I birthed my baby, he came from my womb, he needed assistance to get out but he still came from my body, not the Dr's.
i had two fantastic vaginal births.
then i had a c-section.
in my mind i gave birth twice and had my last one removed from me.
MoonstoneMumma
22-12-2006, 09:21
I felt like i had my baby stolen from me.
i was pushing for 3 hours then they said we needed a c/section, i was fine with that as i was still going to see him come out. but then the epi didn't work so i was put under a general. when i woke up i felt groggy and empty. no dh or baby around me. just feeling sick and empty. no memory of first hugs or first feed. no memory of when dh and i met our baby for the first time. no seeing dh's reactions to meeting his son.
i am slowly getting over it but by no means have i ever used or have ever felt that i gave birth.
Hokey Pokey
22-12-2006, 09:53
Yes I gave birth, to give birth is to give a child a "birthday" right? So yes, I gave birth, regardless how I did it!! :thumbsup:
SassyMummy
22-12-2006, 20:07
I don't believe I gave birth... I lay there and was sliced open. I didn't GIVE anything, because all I did was lay there. I didn't feel like an active participant... in fact, I hardly felt a damn thing (partly because the spinal had blocked the feeling from below my boobs...).
For me, I don't feel that I gave birth because I didn't do any work. My baby was BORN, but I didn't GIVE BIRTH.
It's really hard to explain, but it's all to do with my feelings about my caesarean.. .I'm sure if I had WANTED a caesarean, or even been neutral about it, I might feel differently. But because I definately DID NOT EVER WANT a caesarean, I can only think of it as NOT giving birth.
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