Settling and CC?

[masterchefMamma]

Hi...again!
Can anyone offer some assistance? Over the last few weeks I have been having issues with settling our DD who is almost 9 months old.
Everyone so far thru bubhub has offered excellent advice and suggestions as to why she is not settling etc...which I greatly appreciate!
However I am again looking for advice. The oher night our DD woke up in the middle of the night and well just did not want to go back to sleep. It was an absolute nightmare for us! Constant crying. The issue is that she has never learnt how to self settle. We have always rocked her, patted her bottom and now its gotten to the point that we have to carry her to fall asleep...that night I carried her for 1.5 hours!
Hubby had to be up for work at 4am and me just a few hours after.
Anyway following that episode I took this week off work and decided to try CC.
Today is the second full day and it seems to be going well. Mind you I am in there every few minutes singing and reassuring her that mummy still loves her! (how horrible do I feel too!)
The last two days in the mornig its taken her a max of 10 minutes to fall asleep and in the afternoon both times I have left her and she self settled with no crying.:smiliedance:
The evenings she has cried again tho asleep within 10-15min.
My question is...how long do I let this routine go on for before I decide that its not working?
Should she be totally falling asleep with no crying by next week? Do they ever self settle by themselves?
I have also booked her into Tresillian but thats in 4 weeks time.
When do I say enough is enough and should I go back to carying her? If I do sometimes the minute I put her into the cot she senses this and wakes up...even tho I have been carying her for 30 odd minutes?

Any suggestions are welcome at all.

PS...she is teething too...but all 5 teeth has come thur her gums.

???

[Rhys'Mum]

When we were at QE11, the residential centre here in Canberra, most people had a breakthrough day on day 3. For some it got worse early day 3 and then by the next day it got better. Within the 5 day stay there was generally enough for the people I spoke with to see that it was working for them, although I know in our case returning home set us back a day or so and it was probably a fortnight before I really felt comfortable with how things were as we really regularly had no tears. For some it seems the 3 days was all it took, depends on bub, you and how established things are I guess.

Even if you feel you have had good progress, if you can utilise the support tresillion offers I would think it could only be a good thing. We got so much benefit from seeing others if nothing else - I didn't feel like such a lousy mum afterwards.

The really big benefit I found in the residential stay was really learning the different cries my son makes and feeling like I hadn't necessarily got it wrong before. There is a difference when he's upset, scared, hurt or cranky and I find it helps me to know that not just in terms of sleep but in other interactions. Some may well have been able to just trust their instincts but I'm not even sure I had them, let alone hear them and trust them...

[Mrs Potts]

It sounds to me like CC is working perfectly for you. Why do you ask how long to see if it works?

A bit of crying is very normal, and is part of what babies do to self settle. Sometimes they will drop off without a peep, other times they need to have a grizzle/cry/whinge to settle themselves. This doesn't mean that CC isn't working, so definitely don't go back to carrying bub around to sleep. They will also tend to cry more to settle if they are overtired so watch carefully for tired signs and put her to bed as soon as you spot them.

It sounds like you're doing a great job though!

[aimz]

I agree with Mrs Potts, i did CC with my DD and even now (2 months later) she sometimes needs to have a grizzle to fall asleep..... especially with her late afternoon nap. The point that your bub is now putting themselves to sleep grizzle or no grizzle just shows how successful it has been!! you deserve a huge pat on the back!!! The way i look at it a few minutes crying in bed is a lot better than a cranky overtired bubby :)

Good luck

[masterchefMamma]

Hi all,

Thank you kindly for replying. The reason I am asking how long I have to wait to know if it works is that ok I might babble on a bit here but my MIL is totally and utterly against it! :shame:
She seems to be of the opinion that DD will be traumatised and what I am doing is neglect and abuse.
I was just wondering if those of you who have done it, if there comes a point in time where your little ones were just put in the cot and they went to sleep without crying at all...for several weeks?
My MIL looks after our DD as well as I am at work and refuses to do CC, she cant settle her and thee are days where DD sleeps for only an hour or has had no sleep at all! Simply because they cant settle her. MIL has suggested the I take DD to see a naturopath as see needs some assistance? Well we did and guess what...it didnt work!
I guess I am just venting now but I think our DD needs consistnecy and it will only confuse her if I do CC at home and she gets rocked in MIL's ?
So I have taken the last week off work and spent the time with DD and am taking the time out to teach her how to self settle with CC.
I must admit...it is absolutely killing me and I have had a few cires myself but its ever so satisfying when I have put her in the cot twice now in the afternoons and she has gone to sleep without a cry.
I guess I was just seeing if there is a point in time where I stop using the CC method is every time I put her in the cot she cries, only for a few minutes.
Last night she was teething and so it did take me over 40 minutes to settle her down.
I guess I am down at the moment with lack of sleep and being made to feel this way by my MIL.:gloomy:

[aimz]

You poor thing - the thing with CC is consistency.... when do you go back? monday?? hopefully by then your bub will be used to the fact that sleep time means sleep time.... do you have a routine? if you do perhaps you could type it out for your mil to follow, this is what i do when my mum or mil look after my bub..... explain your reasons for doing cc..... i always tell people i would rather have a happy baby when shes awake then a grumpy one and if that means letting her cry a bit when i put her down then so be it.... there will be off days! i've had 3 of them this week lol but the good ones far outweigh the bad..

have you perhaps thought of alternative care? my day care mum follows exactly what i do at home.... just a thought.....

my thoughts are with you in this stressful time but stick to ur guns - is your hubby supportive of CC?

[masterchefMamma]

thanks aimz.
I took from tuesday till this coming monday in the hope that I could get her (DD) used to CC.
She does have a routine however in saying that my MIL under no circumstances will follow or allow for CC.
I have explained the importance of this and its just like talking to a brick wall.
I have to say that the teething has no helped either!
Thanks again tho and I'll just need to soildier on with this one.
I am booked into Tresillian for the 13th of December for their day stay, see how that goes.
I just dont want to be confusing the poor hing by making her cry here and then nanna picks her up and rocks her off to sleep.
Thanks again,

[susiehomemaker]

We have been using CC since DD was only about 2 months old- some days it was the only was she would go to sleep! If I had no luck rocking her I would just put her down and time 5 minutes, if it got to 6 minutes I would go and pick her up. Now she is almost 1 she only cries herself to sleep half the time. But we still have the occasional off day (sick or teeth) where you have to go and calm her down before putting her down for her nap again. I sympathise with you re your MIL! My own Mum was hopeless, DD would be crying for 1 minute and she would be "I cant stand it- can I pick her up?" She has since learnt that I am right and that she will be asleep within 5-10 minutes (depending on how cranky she is- she has a stubborn streak- cant imagine where she got that from ;-) But at least Mum listened. You are right to be concerned about the whole inconsistancy thing too- it just doesnt work if everyone doesnt do the same thing. All I can suggest is what aimz said about finding alternative care. It's either that or quiting your job really. Or getting through to your MIL somehow (sounds unlikely though- is your hubby on your side?) I was lucky I have not had to go back to work yet, but when I do it will be Mum looking after her, and at least she will do what I ask (now that she has seen that I am right!)

[masterchefMamma]

hubby is on my side but then he is also n MIL's. Aparently she is trying to do what is best by all of us and help...well it isnt helping. I do have her on the consistency thing tho so thats a start.
Time will tell come Monday when I drop her off and MILs place and see what happens.
I'm in Crows Nest NSW so trying to find care and full time care is like trying to find a needle in a hay stack.
I would prefer a family day care environment and so am on several waiting lists. I made a point of discussinng this with hubby saying that at 12 or 15 months we are putting our daughter into care...if its available.
The good thing is that I am taking 4 weeks off over the xma break so will get lots of practice with settling her myself.
Small success this afternoon....put her in the cot and no crying...straight to sleep.:smiliedance: :smiliedance:

[aimz]

wonderful that is great news!! when i first started CC i kept a diary of her sleeping habits and if it was successful i would write success next to it - sounds anal but it really helped when i was having a rough day to look back.....

well worst case scenario you can hold off until your holidays and then restart it if your mil is really not helping you.... hopefully with that amount of time it will be working and you can go back to work refreshed ready for the new year.....

[Mrs Potts]

It must be very hard for you to have to deal with your MIL. Not to mention your poor bub - she would be so confused. There is absolutely no point at all in you doing CC if your MIL is going to pick her up straight away. Maybe you can tell her that if she won't do it your way, that you'll be calling her at 2am to settle the bub her way.... OK so I'm a ***** LOL

MIL needs to respect what you're doing and trust that you know what's best for your own bub.

I agree with aimz though. If your MIL really won't respect what you're doing you might be best to wait til your hols to focus on CC. But even then, she will still grizzle a lot of the time when she self settles. From memory, DS was still crying at age 2 when he was put down for day naps. We started CC at 6 weeks....

Heck, DS is 5.5 now and still likes to whinge and moan when he goes to bed! ;)

[Nan]

Hi MB!
My DD still cries occasionally to get to sleep. Usually only for a minute. A protest cry!! It is completely normal. The point is that she gets off to sleep on her own now. It sounds like your bubs is doing really well. Sometimes DD cries but about 70% of the time she doesn't.
I agree that consistency is the key. Do you have any other options other than your MIL? People who will support you in your decision & help with the consistency?
Love,
Nan. xx

[Stellabella]

Hi mammaBella,

We tried CC with our daughter when she was seven and a half months old. We saw a doctor who was an infant sleep specialist for some advice and used his 'cold turkey' method. We established a bedtime routine (dinner, bath and story) then put her to bed. The first night she cried for 40 minutes straight, the second fifteen, the third a little and by the fourth she learned to self settle. We started with night sleep as it is supposed to be easier to change than day sleeps. The doctor said an hour of crying is quite normal, even up to two hours, and on occassion some babies have cried for three hours without problem. You and hubby need to support each other through this.

She still occassionally cries (they have a few tries at pulling you on!), and sometimes still wakes in the middle of the night, we just go in and make some soothing sounds. We were told not to go her when she was crying, but to check on her when she had stopped (to make sure she was safe etc.). It was hard the first couple of days but worth the effort.

As for the trouble with your MIL, when DD was a few weeks old we were told by child nurse that you should never leave your baby to cry, that it damages them later on in life, etc. When I told our doctor this he was horrified and said saying such things (which are not supported by any research) is dangerous, irresponsible and traumatises families who have to cope with a child you cannot self settle and who are themselves sleep deprived. I think you may have to lay down the law with MIL. I'm sure she thinks she is doing right by you and your child, but the results you are getting would suggest otherwise. it's okay for babies to cry sometimes - that's what they do, that's the most powerful form of communication (and often the only one they have!),

Teaching your bub to self settle is not only a great skill for her, but a relief for you and hubby so you can rest and spend some time together.

I wish you the best of luck and encourage you to stick with it. It will work!!!

[masterchefMamma]

hi Stellabella (great name!)
I agree with everything you have said, infact agree with everything everyone has said so far.
MIL has accepted my decision and so far has done it for the last two days.
We had a confrontation chat on the weekend and unfortunately it got to the point where I politely had to say I love your input and suggestions and I respect that you are trying to help but at the end of the day I am her mother and its my decision and what I say is final.
The positive thing is that DD has been sleeping thru the night so far.
Sure there will be days when she tries it on again but I really am seeing a huge difference in her ability to settle and most importantly to go back to sleep if and when she wakes up herself.
I only wish that I had tried this sooner as it would have saved me three months of grief!

[Stellabella]

Hi mammaBella,

Congrats to you on your success with dealing with MIL. You are right - DD is your child and it should be done your way. Glad to hear your MIL is supporting you.

I'm glad your bub is sleeping well again. Make sure you get plenty of rest for the test time she tries to pull you on again!

Hope it continues to go well for your family!