All Melbourne Birth Centres NOT GOOD

[lilpearl]

Hello,

I'd just like to warn you all that there isn't one birth centre in Melbourne dedicated to the care of women. I have had a brilliant VBAC at the birth centre at the RPA in Sydney - where I had a water birth. I was not only supported in a natural water birth, but encouraged...the midwives were brilliant and all went beautifully. As we all know, in most cases, a VBAC is just as safe as any other birth and, certainly, a lot more straight-forward than most first-time births. This is a fact, and all evidence-based research has proved this. Now in Melbourne, I've only come across midwives in birth centres turning me away, saying they are not willing to take me. So much for women-centered care, and family-friendly birth. These birth centres are run by the hospitals to the extent that if you choose to have your baby there, you are under the care of MEDwives, not midwives...and regardless of some people having 'good' experiences there, that is irrelevant. The fact is, they do not allow VBAC's - that says it all. People have good experiences everywhere. But do remember, the only places that truly support women are those that see birth as a normal social event, and not a medical one. The midwives in these Melbourne birth centres did not choose to be a midwife to care for birthing women, they have decided to become as bad as the bad obs in this country and categorise women, take away their birth experience and increase their chance of post-natal depression, not to mention the cascade of very dangerous intervention that they are subjected to when left with their only choice as a hospital birth. Please people, join birth rites and birth coalition and help stop this disgusting degradation of women and their rights to choose THEIR birth. The treatment I have received from EVERY birth centre in Melbourne has left me floored - I simply can't believe that in AUSTRALIA we are being treated like animals - it angers me beyond reproach. If you haven't done your reading (beyond 'What To Expect When Your Expecting'), please do so.....every woman owes it to every other woman to ensure that we have the best care available for our pregnancies and births (and beyond). Anyone who thinks the birthing system in Australia is satisfactory, is blinded by ignorance. Please all, lets do our research, lets care, and lets get the ball rolling!

[bubbles28]

Well said:thumbsup:
I agree with you.
It's an unfair system we have to fight against

[Mamaduke]

May I also suggest writing a letter to your local member of Parliament and a phone call to Neil Mitchell on 3AW wouldn't go astray...everyone listens to Neil and it's a great way to get this injustice out in the public eye.

[TwoBoysOnly]

a VBAC is just as safe as any other birth and, certainly, a lot more straight-forward than most first-time births. This is a fact, and all evidence-based research has proved this.

The midwives in these Melbourne birth centres did not choose to be a midwife to care for birthing women, they have decided to become as bad as the bad obs in this country and categorise women,

Firstly I agree that VBAC's should be allowed and taken as a natural birthing event however I do not agree that the research states that it is just as safe as any other birth and a lot more straight forward than most first time births. Where did you get that research from, I would certainly be interested to read it. VBAC's pose with them a risk of uterine rupture which can mask itself as either maternal or foetal distress, in which case almost always a repeat c/s is required. It is for this reason that a lot of birth centres across Aust will not allow VBAC's to deliver in the birth centre if there is not sufficient access to the medical team and OT. Secondly, being a midwife I can guarantee you that looking after a primip in labour is much more straight forward than looking after a VBAC. Yes you may have laboured previously but you haven't pushed a baby out so in that case you, your pelvis, and your perineum are all first timers in that instance just like the woman having her first time birth. It is often not until this pushing stage that uterine rupture is at it's greatest, therefore you are often restricted to the amount of time you are "allowed" to push for so not to stress that scar too much.

As for the midwives working in those Melbourne birth centres, often you will find that they are tied down by the constraints of the organisation in which they work in, the medicos that oversee the policies and procedures that take place there, even despite some hard evidence it is often hard to change the minds of medical superintendents and the like. I assume it isn't easy for them to work in such a 'woman centered' environment yet not be able to deliver woman centered care. I think you will find all midwives have within them a drive to support women and their needs and rights, sometimes however it is difficult to execute this when those larger medical obstacles get in your way. The only way we can overcome this is by union and letter writing to the powers and to bring indemnity insurance for midwives back.,......:banghead:

[MummyCharmzy]

I disagree, I think the melbourne birth centres are extremely responsible for this.

Heres a little scenario for you, I recently had my 3rd csect, I had asked many times if I could try for a VBA2C and was told 'no way' I went into surgery and my uterus was so thin the surgeons told me with almost certaintity that if I had have gone into labour my uterus would have ruptured. What would the outcome have been if I was at a birth centre as i had dreamed of? Do they have the equiptment there to do an absolute emergency csect with moments notice? no? my daughter would have died and I could have too.

There are very good reasons they do not like VBAC's at birth centres and imo any birth centre that does is totally irresponsible and putting mothers and babies lives at risk.

[defaipe]

I disagree, I think the melbourne birth centres are extremely responsible for this.

Heres a little scenario for you, I recently had my 3rd csect, I had asked many times if I could try for a VBA2C and was told 'no way' I went into surgery and my uterus was so thin the surgeons told me with almost certaintity that if I had have gone into labour my uterus would have ruptured. What would the outcome have been if I was at a birth centre as i had dreamed of? Do they have the equiptment there to do an absolute emergency csect with moments notice? no? my daughter would have died and I could have too.

There are very good reasons they do not like VBAC's at birth centres and imo any birth centre that does is totally irresponsible and putting mothers and babies lives at risk.

yep im with you! i have heard of so many VBAC gone wrong if i ever needed a cs there is no way i would have a vb again.. so if a birth center wont take vbac's isnt that their choice?? i realise its your choice of not to have a vbac but they deliver babies every day, obviously they have seen many births go wrong so they feel the risk is unnecessary. if you're dead set on a vbac why not have it at a hospital?? if a emergency cs is needed it will be done.
i just think they have their reasons and that should be accepted. just as you have every right to have a vbac. in the safest circumstances possible.

[WitchHazel]

Secondly, being a midwife I can guarantee you that looking after a primip in labour is much more straight forward than looking after a VBAC.

Sorry to be dopey, but what does the term primip mean?:o

[WeThree]

Why not just have a home birth then? :)

[flib]

I agree that birth centres should be more supportive.

After my emergency c-section, I didn't feel comfortable using the public system again if I couldn't use a birth centre. The idea being that you have the support for a natural birth but have medical assistance on hand IF needed. I considered home birth very carefully but in the end decided to go private for my second child in order to have a VBAC. I very carefully chose a great Ob - one of the very few who not only believes that a natural birth is a women's right but also believes that low intervention brings the best outcomes. Needless to say, I had a great VBAC and felt supported. My Ob wasn't there for most of my labour because I was at home. He assisted in my daughter's birth and ensured that I didn't tear or need an episiotomy. He didn't do much and told me later that's the way it should be!

My third child is due in 4 weeks so he'll be delivering her and I will have the same support people etc.

It does annoy me that if birth centres aren't available to you that the choice is normal labour ward, homebirth or private Ob. There should be something in between that caters for VBACs in particular that is women centred and staffed by midwives. Specialist Ob should be available when necessary.

[TwoBoysOnly]

primip = first time pregnant woman

[3liddleducks]

Prehaps instead of bagging the work that the midwives in the birth centres are trying to do, have a think about the fact that for the vast majority, they are hitting their heads against brick walls in regards to the political **** and what they can and cannot do in their role as midwife. Their hands are tied!! Try talking to them first and find out just how frustrating it is for many of them to really be 'with woman' in the current flow of birth trends.


M

Student Midwife

[lilpearl]

First of all, that post was written when I was in the early stages of preganncy, and very very angry with my lack of options, so it sounds quite scattered.

However, while I realise it's not entirely the fault of the midwives, it WAS the fault of the hospitals (including Head Of Midwifery). I'm going to be a midwife myself, but will be an independent midwife as soon as I possibly can. The only way to change the system is to change it. I'd probably be fired from hospital after hospital! I care so very deeply for womens birthing rights. Head of Midwifery in any hospital has the power to allow a VBAC in a birth centre, they absolutely do, (a Dr. of Midwifery told me) and they simply chose to ignore me. Hospital Policy is not law.

I've had a fantastic water birth at home and would never do it any other way, now. As a doula, I haven't yet seen a woman's birth treated as completely normal in a hospital. If the midwives are great during the labour, they're still funny about a physiological 3rd stage. It is still an unfortunate fact that some midwives think birth is dangerous until proven otherwise, despite the fact that this is an obstetrical view of birth, supposedly shunned by midwives. I believe birth is safe until proven otherwise, and midwives should be encouraging natural birth, not fearing it. Risk can only be assessed in retrospect. I know midwives push through beurocratic mumbo-jumbo, and a lot of them do a good job of it, but it has to be a wide-spread revolution if there is going to be any change. A woman has a right to birth wherever she chooses, in whatever way she chooses. That is the bottom line.


A reporter on A Current Affair last night used the term "high risk" for a VBAC!! :rolleyes: What a load of B.S! Yes people do have uterine ruptures, whether they've had a caesarean or not. Of course it happens, and of course it is tragic, but people have more chance of tragedy happening when they put themselves 'under' the care of intervention-happy 'professionals'. Makes me sick, really.

During my homebirth, my IM didn't touch me (accept to push on my back with everyone else during my OP labour). She used a doppler every so often, and that was it. I breathed my baby out, my husband caught our baby, my husband clamped the cord when appropriate, I waited an hour and a half for the palcenta to be born. No one feared the birth process at any stage. Of course, it all went perfectly. Almost zero blood loss, not a scratch, and I felt completely and utterly elated for ages afterwards. That's how it should be. My horomones worked in perfect harmony, they danced and flowed and my body was given space, quiet and trust to simply birth. It's so very unfortunate that women don't have the option of having a hospital birth that is so free, because it should be an option. Not everyone wants to birth at home, even if simply for practical reasons.

And ladies, do the research, don't get your info from the media. A VBAC (in most cases) is a VERY safe birth. Certainly not "high risk". Also, ANYONE can have a uterine rupture. The risk increases from .02% to .05% for true uterine rupture (as opposed to a 'window', causing no harm at all). If you really want to put things in perspective, take note. There is more chance of ANYONE having placenta abruption than there is a chance of a scared uterus having a rupture. Given that placenta abruption causes a far higher rate of infant morbidity/mortality than uterine rupture, and given that placenta abruption causes maternal mortality at all (a woman has NEVER died from uterine rupture on a low-segment transverse 'scared' uterus), as well as higher maternal morbidity, it would seem that, using the 'logic' of VBAC as "high risk" would have to conclude that, in fact, EVERY birth is high risk. :no: But no, birth is safe, and natural, and NORMAL, despite the fact that tragedy does happen. There is risk in walking to your lacal shops to get the paper, but it is a normal, safe, enjoyable things to do. One does not become a recluse simply due to the fact that there is risk in their every move. To fear birth is to commit emtional suicide. If we fear birth, we must work through it. That is not to say that women should never have a caesarean, but the desicion cannot be based on bits and pieces of information. You need to put the puzzle together, all by yourself (i.e, don't rely on an obstetrician to give up-to-date, relevant, or evidence bassed information). Cochranes is a great place to start, and Capers Bookstore, as well as Amazon have some very in-depth books that you will not find on your bookstore shelves. University libraries are another great source of information. Become empowered, birth is the MOST amazing thing, no doubt about it. :yes: :thumbsup:

[elissas]

Liana,

Did you try The Angliss Birth Centre in Ferntree Gully? When we had our antenatal classes there the first time, the middies were all for VBAC. It is also one of the few places in Victoria that does water birth (and they were trying to talk everyone into it!).

I'm tipping if The Angliss BC says no, then it is hospital policy and the residing obs etc, rather than the birth centre itself that is to blame given how highly the middies at the BC spoke about VBAC.