View Full Version : Bottle feeding mums - don't worry!
Hi there - I posted this in the current affairs section but thought it might be more appropriate to put it here.
Seems a big study has found that intelligence is not linked to breastfeeding.....just as I have always personally believed, ones intelligence is linked to ones parents IQ! I remember years ago learning about studies which basically showed that our IQs are genetic.....smarter people breed smarter kids (and vs versa unfortunately....lol:devil6: )
So take heart - those of you who are bottlefeeding.......it's not going to make any difference to your childs IQ :thumbsup:
British Medical Journal article here:
http://bmj.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/abstract/bmj.38978.699583.55v1?hrss=1
T
jess_live_die
06-10-2006, 10:43
both mty daughter were bottle feed and for there age are very smart hehe its easy too
my df is smart so jake might be lol i doubt he will get muh intelligence from me... i still have pregnancy brain lol
Ana Gram
06-10-2006, 11:29
I always thought that idea was a complete crock.
I know the benefits of breastfeeding (how can we not when its shoved down our throats..:rolleyes: ) so BF my Dd for 6months(the absolute hardest 6months of my life) and then put her on bottles. I dont think like the idea that 'smarter' women breastfeed...does that mean bottlefeeding mums are stupid?
I know my Dd is smart(biggest bookworm ever!!) and im sure she would have been regardless of being BF or not.
Little Gorilla
06-10-2006, 12:40
I'm sick to death of new study after new study saying this and that about breast feeding - For F Sake.:banghead: :banghead: ..I mean we all know that milk that comes out of the mothers boob is the best natural food for a baby...hands down - no argument from me there. Its just not what every mother decides to do or can do.
One minute they are telling us breast fed babies are more intelligent, hang on thats wrong now:rolleyes: ....now its the mothers who choose to breast feed that are more intelligent:confused: ...how long till that is disproved.
I wish these studies would stop stereotyping mothers who bottle feed - its a load of cr@p.
I always read all these post & they always turn into a fight & I sit back & think why do so many people get so upset over what other people are doing with THERE baby & compare the 2 :confused: We do what we do & what we think is best for our children, breast milk or Formula who cares?? What is important is they are getting nutrients to grow & stay alive either out of a tin or boob..
CrazyBeautiful
06-10-2006, 12:58
My Mother was bottle fed and she has a degree in Accounting..... I was bottle fed and have a degree in Nursing and Social Science and I've got 2 years left to complete a Law degree...... My brother was breast fed and committed suicide!!!!!:crying: :confused: Interesting isn't it!!!!
Ok! So could we please try to not turn this into a slanging match between BF and FF?
Breast IS best IF IT WORKS! If not then lucky for us we dont live in the 40's when condensed milk was the next best thing! YAY for all those compnies who make the formula for those of us who Bottle feed our babies for WHATEVER reason we decide is good enough for us.
My kids were all FF and so far i have a 5 year old who could read before he went to school (no it was not a forced thing he actually pretty much taught himself), who is in Kindergarten doing year 2 work and i have a 3 year old who can do basic maths and is starting to sound his words out and learning to spell. My 19mth old daughter can hold a conversation. I dont think anything has anything to do with IQ. I know that "smart" people can be born into "not so smart" households and vica versa. This has absolutley NOTHING to do with what nutrients you were fed for the first 12 mths or so of your life.
In the grnd scheme of things and when its all said and done IT DOESNT MATTER how you chose to feed your baby because in 10-20 years, no one will actually care. It will be irrelevant.
Can we not all support each other and celebrate the fact that we were able to create life. We're all mothers, we all have issues, we all worry whether we are doing the right thing or not- this is ONE added pressure that we dont need to put on ourselves.
melfunction
06-10-2006, 13:13
So take heart - those of you who are bottlefeeding.......it's not going to make any difference to your childs IQ
No need to take heart, but thanks anyway. My son is the brightest spark there is :D
our little treasures
06-10-2006, 13:14
I believe the other thread was CLOSED due to this sort of petty fighting back and forth!!!!
Whoever starts threads like this are always trying to start problems, because who in their right minds don't realise that this is a firey topic!! Seen as this thread was started after the other thread had got nasty, I think that this one needs to be closed as it is already getting heated!!!
IF YOUR COMFORTABLE AT YOUR DECISIONS, NO STUDY WOULD UPSET YOU EITHER FOR OR AGAINST!!
~EmsMum~
06-10-2006, 13:31
I always thought that idea was a complete crock.
I know what you mean
Little Gorilla
06-10-2006, 13:36
This sort of study doesn't upset me - it just annoys me.
I wish I had breast fed but I didn't - it was a good decision for me at the time not to.
So maybe if there are some bottle feeding mums out there that are feeling a bit inadequate because of these studies and guilty because they didn't breast feed, why can't these mums come to this thread and put across their thoughts on the subject without someone coming in here turning it into an us -v- them.
My original post was put there because...it was my opinion on this topic...nothing wrong with that is there?:mad:
Angelmist♥
06-10-2006, 13:46
I don't know where they come up with this stuff TBH.I've been thinking about just my and DH's family.
On DH's side they were all fully FF from birth then put onto cow's milk at 3mths.DH is extremely intelligent (:laughing: with most things!), one sister is a Nurse and the other's a Store manager (and could have been anything she wanted but had her 1st of 5 kids at 16).
I was fully BF and yeah somewhat intelligent:laughing: (I probably could be if I had the inclination!),my brother was fully FF and he's a professor and my sister was a mix between both and is a boilermaker!
All 3 of my children have been FF (not my choice) and both DS's are top of their respective classes.
Every week a new thread just like this one pops up. As parents we all have to make responsible decisions regarding our children on a daily basis. Whether we chose to breast feed or bottle feed shouldn't matter, despite all of these "research articles". The same goes for the cloth vs disposable nappy debate. The personal decisions we make in regards to the upbringing of our children is exactly that, PERSONAL DECISIONS.
I really don't understand why everyone feels the need to jump into all of these threads everytime they emerge as it always evolves into the same debate each and every time.
As adults we should all just accept each others decisions within our own families and let everyone else do what they want to do. These "articles" do nothing but cause trouble and debates where they are not needed.
Missus S
06-10-2006, 13:57
Wow - I can't believe people are told to get out of certain threads based on what they are doing. These forums are for sharing information & support.
I see the results of this study are a huge WIN for FF'ing mothers. One of the reasons that I beat myself up so much about failing with my BF'ing was because I thought there was that link between BF/FF and intelligence. I am so glad this large, well designed study has come out in a reputable journal............makes me personally feel a lot better. I don't give a hoot about myself..........but at least I know that my inability to BF my DD is not likely to impact on her intelligence.
I was actually quite offended by some of the posts & titles of new threads started earlier today by SOME of the BF'ing mums. I found them quite insensitive to the plenty of mums out there who would prefer to be BF'ing.........which is why I made a tongue-in-cheek comment about how sooooo intelligent I am. I do admire mums who BF and I know not all of them think like that.
And it's important to remember with studies like these - they are just simply talking about averages of the sample population. So we could still have people with very low IQ's who BF and those with extremely high IQ's who FF, and vice versa of course ;)
Little Gorilla
06-10-2006, 13:57
So if bottle feeding mums are feeling a bit upset and confused about bottle feeding when they sit at home and hear about these new studies....and they are a member of bubhub...why can't they come and post in a thread like this?
The breast feeding mums can have a thread all patting themselves on the back when these studies come up with new results....why can't we have the same thing?
If we were all going to accept each others decisions with everything then there would be no need for half the sections on bubhub.
:banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:
I did NOT start this thread to cause trouble.........I started it because there is a new bit of solid research which dispells the notion that breastfeeding makes children more intelligent.......which I myself have been told several times on internet forums such as this one and by well meaning persons (some professional) to try and make me somehow get more motivated to breastfeed............when I tried and couldn't. Made me feel ****.
If you read the article - it simply makes the point that IQ tends to be something which is passed on via genetics, rather then breast or bottle feeding making any difference. NO MORE...NO LESS!
Yes - how they did the study was analyse the mums IQs AND the DADs too I think..........but there were also many other factors and childrens / siblings IQ varied slightly as one would expect.........but independent of their type of feeding......iykwim? Besides, 4 IQ points or 1 SD is hardly a huge difference in intelligence (overall between the b/f & bottleF mums in the study) I have done 3 IQ tests in my life and got a difference of 20 points in my lowest and highest score!!! Where would that make ME fit into this study? whilst they are a relevant test - I believe like anything else - it depends how many of them you do - my score got better the more times I practiced at doing them - the first time, I was 17yrs old and had NO IDEA what it was going to "ask" - the 3rd one - I was "ready, set go" Which I think PROVES that human beings CAN actually develop their intelligence over time - perhaps the basic speed with which ones brain works doesn't improve, but ones ability to USE it does.....kwim? This actually was the topic on Catalyst last night which proved that "wisdom" and brain functioning does improve with age - in most areas!!! All quite facinating to me - BUT makes common sense also.......wouldn't you say??
Can't believe how nasty the other thread got and am sad that even this one is going down the same path. I posted it for support - if breastfeeders can post articles to support their beliefs, then why would this one be any different? It's in the paper today - takes up 1/4 a page!!
Please calm down everyone - do what you want to do with your baby - I just hope the bottle feeders who have been feeling guilty because they are supposedly (as told to ME by a few) going to hurt their childs intelligence potential by FF........ARE now feeling better about it in THIS respect ONLY.....OKAY?? :hugs:
T
mum2tara
06-10-2006, 14:07
Hey guys - why do we have to harp on where we are different...I understood that the whole idea of bubhub is that we all share something in common (that is, we all have babies/kids).
Hey, I breastfed - big deal - I don't think that makes me any smarter/wiser/superior than any bottle-feeding mums who for their own personal and valid reasons chose that option.
Why is it that people always think they know what's best for everyone else - I struggle enough with getting things right myself - I'm not gonna start lecturing perfectly good mums on what they choose! One of my friends was made to feel so bad about not being able to breastfeed that she got quite bad depression - how good for her baby was that??
This was just a bit of news to be shared and why don't we all just share it in the manner it was meant.
Little Gorilla
06-10-2006, 14:11
Sorry if my comments are coming off as passive agressive...however, they are just my views and my experiences.
Missus S
06-10-2006, 14:15
Please calm down everyone - do what you want to do with your baby - I just hope the bottle feeders who have been feeling guilty because they are supposedly (as told to ME by a few) going to hurt their childs intelligence potential by FF........ARE now feeling better about it in THIS respect ONLY.....OKAY?? :hugs:
Yep..........as I said this new study has made me feel so much better. I'm so glad you posted the details of it for us Tannie.
You know what? I think I rock purely because I feed my baby, love my baby give her attention and everything I possibly can... I think she will thrive in her life because of this- regardless of the fact that she ended up needing to be FF... :thumbsup:
Angelmist♥
06-10-2006, 14:30
You know what? I think I rock purely because I feed my baby, love my baby give her attention and everything I possibly can... I think she will thrive in her life because of this- regardless of the fact that she ended up needing to be FF... :thumbsup:
:yelclap: :yelclap: I ROCK TOO!!!!!!!! :yelclap:
Missus S
06-10-2006, 14:33
You took the words out of my mouth Billy! I was just going to add to my post that ALL mums who love & care for their babies to the best of their abilities ROCK :) (I'm feeling the love in this thread)
You took the words out of my mouth Billy! I was just going to add to my post that ALL mums who love & care for their babies to the best of their abilities ROCK :) (I'm feeling the love in this thread)
LOL Here here!! :smiliedance:
hi all just wondering what formula you can suggest i know each aby is different but just wanted some ideas and suggestions
ta
tina
RedPanda
06-10-2006, 14:44
This is the way I look at the whole issue. Breastfeeding your child gives him/her a great head start. If life was a running race, maybe bf children have slightly better shoes. However, there could be a bottlefed baby next to them who is just naturally a faster runner.
There are great benefits to breastfeeding, but parenting is so much more than feeding. IQ comes from genes, stimulation and environment. You could bf a baby until it was 5, but unless it received the right stimulation, it's not going to be Einstein.
It's an interesting study, but all these studies will never prove anything conclusively. People are just far too different for these general "rules". I reckon feed your baby however you can, love it, and encourage it! If you can bf great, if not, don't stress too much!
:wave: I am a primary teacher with over 10 years experience. I can honestly say that when I look around my classroom I would not be able to tell you which of my students were breastfed or which were bottle fed. I firmly believe that a child's ability to learn and cope in the big wide world is directly related to their environment eg Do you talk to them, Do you play with them, Do you spend time with them, Do you read to them? etc The kids who are lucky enough to have parents who take the time to do these things, and not just buy them things as substitutes for these, turn out to be the most successful in my experience.
Jo
Ps I bottle feed my beautiful girl, however would have loved to have breast fed. But she is happy and healthy and that's all that matters.
Ana Gram
06-10-2006, 16:16
Well why not ask for a section to be created - I am sure Hilary will oblige;)
Because I don't think it is needed. There are plenty of threads which ask the same thing, that anyone who doesn't agree is not welcome.
Oscar's mum
06-10-2006, 16:19
Because I don't think it is needed.
But didn't you just say that the frustration by many is stemming from FF's not having a section where they can post about 'celebrating FF' without having ppl who disagree with FF posting comments?
Ana Gram
06-10-2006, 16:33
It stems from a section created for a particular group where any disagreeing comment or "negative" comment is deleted and not welcome. And where those who can comment, can seemingly comment whatever they like with no regard as to how it may make others feel. I personally don't feel any section which excludes others and gives them no oppertunity to defend themselves, their actions or opinions is needed. I think it breeds animosity especially as comments can be read and not answered.
When we opened the celebrating BFing section - it was not there to allow BF mothers to denigrate FF mothers (at all). If you happen to see anything of that nature, report it and we will remove it.
We also have several "support only" threads scattered among various sections. The point of these threads is never to restrict who responds in which area, but what they respond with.
I personally prefer a minimal amount of segregation on the hub, because I enjoy a polite, rational debate - and do not want us to splinter into various camps / tribes. We should not all have to agree to get along.
Cheers
Oscar's mum
06-10-2006, 16:59
It stems from a section created for a particular group where any disagreeing comment or "negative" comment is deleted and not welcome. And where those who can comment, can seemingly comment whatever they like with no regard as to how it may make others feel. I personally don't feel any section which excludes others and gives them no oppertunity to defend themselves, their actions or opinions is needed. I think it breeds animosity especially as comments can be read and not answered.
True - any thread like that will create animosity amongst others, but then again if their was a 'celebrating FF' thread wouldn't that be good to be able to post and not have ppl who breastfeed coming in stating why formula is bad blah blah blah:ecomcity:, by having something like that at least you could discuss FF without every thread turning into a debate;)
misskittyfantastico
06-10-2006, 17:06
I have cleaned this thread up and removed any unhelpful posts.
Anyone who enters any thread and makes unhelpful or unsupportive comments will have their comments editted.
This section is here to support those who bottlefeed. If anyone finds a post they believe does not fit into this category, please report it by clicking on the triangle in the right hand corner of the screen and it will be dealt with.
Lets just respect each other ladies!
SamanthaJane
06-10-2006, 18:14
A specific thread for bottle feeding, like one that has been discussed in this thread, has previously been requested http://www.bubhub.com.au/community/forums/showthread.php?t=33520 however, the idea was declined by the administrator
Well I currently breastfeed my baby but I am pretty sure I was bottlefed, I keep forgetting to ask my mother and to be honest it doesn't really matter much at this point coz I'm weaned LOL!!
Studies like these usually turn out to be a crock.
I keep forgetting to ask my mother and to be honest it doesn't really matter much at this point coz I'm weaned LOL!!
:laughing: :laughing:
Thank you for the laugh shed! :hugs: :laughing:
A specific thread for bottle feeding, like one that has been discussed in this thread, has previously been requested http://www.bubhub.com.au/community/forums/showthread.php?t=33520 however, the idea was declined by the administrator
Why?????
I did read the post but in all honesty, how is that fair?
Why do we have a "support for mums who bottlefeed" but a "celebrate breastfeeding" thread?
Why cant we celebrate both??:confused:
melfunction
06-10-2006, 19:26
Shouldn't we just be celebrating the fact that our babies are happy and healthy? Who really cares how someone feeds their child as long as the child is fed?
I know I don't need a celebrate ff section. It's getting way out of hand now (tit for tat, us v's them blah, blah) and I'm sure the mods have better things to do than read/edit/delete whinging from us fomula feeders about why there is no 'special' section for ff.
We are all adults (well, most :rolleyes: )
Thank you SJ for remembering that!
I just want to put a point forward regarding that and please if you feel its inappropriate just delete mods.
I feel that breast feeding is favoured over formula feeding. I was declined for a celebrate formula feeding thread and im not 100% sure why. I have noticed in these celebrate bf threads there are comments that offend me. For example a thread in celebrating bf that says people with higher IQ are more likely to bf.
I didnt mention anything but I actually took offense to that.
I understand that Bfing is a good source of nutrition but some of the comments made about FFing are quite hurtful and obviously ppl dont understand some of the pain ffing mothers go through.
Thanks for reading!
the_queen
06-10-2006, 19:45
Actually Bailey'sMum, a lot of the BFers know exactly what it is like to be forced to give up breastfeeding.
Shouldn't we just be celebrating the fact that our babies are happy and healthy? Who really cares how someone feeds their child as long as the child is fed?
I know I don't need a celebrate ff section. It's getting way out of hand now (tit for tat, us v's them blah, blah) and I'm sure the mods have better things to do than read/edit/delete whinging from us fomula feeders about why there is no 'special' section for ff.
We are all (well, most :rolleyes: )
Have to agree with you there :thumbsup:
I understand how you feel BM, but I just choose not to care what other people say, as I know that MY bub is thriving and reaching all her milestones (which I think proves just how high IQ she has :D ) Most breastfeeding mums on here are not trying to have a go at you (us who FF) I don't think... I know I always feel impressed when I meet a mum who was able to BF for years, and I have never felt looked down upon by those people. The ones who say things to upset you personally are just not worth your time :hugs:
I personally don't think it will ever happen whilst doctors etc all recommend breastfeeding as best... IYKWIM
misskittyfantastico
06-10-2006, 20:15
This is my opinion, not as a mod but as someone who has both breast and formula fed.
I think most women know the pain of being unsuccessful at BFing - even when you are successful it can be traumatic and horrible.
Breast is best. This cannot be disputed. My DD drinks formula every night and I'm okay with this....formula isn't evil!
I have taken big notice of everyones views and I will pass them on to administration.
Please, please if you have any concerns PM a mod.:)
That "breast is best"......that's the PC line that is constantly pushed down our throats as mothers....from before we have the baby to years after....no matter what we do - it's never "Good enough" unless we breastfeed them till they are schoolage...apparently!!!!.......the very subtle but sure message that one gets from everywhere, is that FF is inferior as just the constant use of the word "BEST" infers this IMO....obviously.
I however, have a different opinion...........I believe that whilst BreastMILK might be the better nutrition option for newborn human babies......breastfeeding is not necessarily BEST for all mothers or babies. I will (of course) be shot down in flames, for even remotely suggesting that mothers should FF if they want to.............as I was told in no uncertain terms (on another site) - my inability to "persist" with breastfeeding - means that I was not 100% committed to it.......hence, I need to accept that I am giving my children an inferior start to life in many ways..........if that's not RUDE - then I don't know what is?!!? But of course, that's allowed to be said to we FF mums - if we retaliate in any way we get the superior attitude of "but ultimately we ALL know that breast is best.....so......" :ecomcity:
My paed (and another personal friend who is a paed too) just say "yadda, yadda, yadda....who cares?" They certainly don't! They push the "B/F line" because they have to........but they really couldn't care less whether I did it or not......like the obs and birth options - they try to stay out of all this "catfighting" between we petty women :banghead: Doesn't THAT in itself just tell us something??!!
And once again - I put in the thread because it is a valid piece of interesting recent research. I thought FF mums might be able to take some comfort from it....because god knows - we sure NEED some GOOD news about bottle feeding occassionally - don't we? :yelclap:
T
I was writing mine when the post before was put up.........I am not trying to have a go at the moderator!
T
As a moderator I am saddened to see yet another breast vs formula debate. In my opinion we should all be striving for a community where people are fully educated about their options, and make informed and well supported decisions in parenting, no matter what the issue is. This approach doesn't involve people feeling guilty, being made to feel guilty, or judgements being passed. Let's focus on supporting each other and stop the "us vs them" mentality.
This thread will now be closed. Thank you to all who contributed.
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