When can babies learn to vomit to stall sleep time?

[share a book]

I asked this in another thread but haven't been answered and probably won't be answered so now I'm asking in a new thread.

It's about T i z z y H a l l stating that children learn to vomit and how many people leave them if they vomit.

I don't want a T i z z y debate I want to know when children or babies can learn to vomit to stall sleep time as in how old are they when they work it out?

[MissPoss]

My personal opinion is no.

I can't vomit on command, I don't know many people that can. Not only do I think they are physiologically incapable, I also don't think they possess the manipulative skills needed to perform such an act.

[drewid]

Same as PP. I can't do it just cos I want to. All of my reflexes actually push me AGAINST it, even when I need to.

Can't help but think how much easier it would be to have an eating disorder if you could just vomit just cos you want to, instead of having to use your fingers down your throat.

I've never thought that the 'theory' about vomiting to put off sleeping was about the actual sleeping - more about the emotional feelings and distress that upset their little tummies so much that they vomit.

[shawniesmiss]

Agreed,
Try sitting there and without any fingers or foreign objects and vomit.
Impossible! How are u thinking a baby, a small human who can barely move much is capable of such a thing?!
This is silly. If ur child is vomiting alot then umm im guessing they may have a problem or could be lactose intollerant like my DS and DD.





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[share a book]

Is it the same when they are 5? Or when they are teens? Is there ever a time when they *can* vomit at will for whatever reason? Avoid an exam as a teen? Avoid school at 8? Avoid bed time at 2?

[Boobycino]

I've seen a toddler ram his fingers down his throat repeatedly to throw up at meal time in protest to being fed... He was about 2ish. So I'll go with 2 years. even then I'm only 85% sure he was totally doing it on purpose because he would get distressed about it afterwards... And then do it again. It was rather gross. We just left him alone for mealtimes, if he ate he ate, if not what could we do?

Not - in my opinion - at 11 months according to TH :-/

[share a book]

What about without fingers? On command but without fingers?

[*Need~More~Coffee~Please*]

I think if they are vomiting they are clearly quiet distressed and therefor arn't really doing it for no reason kwim ? They have worked themself up and are upset .

As for the above post about when they are older im not sure ? My cousin who is a bit younger than me used to get really bad anxiety and it would cause her to throw up it happend once to her in the playground when she was in kindy ( i was in about 5 th grade at the time at the same school )

[Boobycino]

I seriously doubt anyone except the uniquely talented could vomit on command without using their fingers.

I threw up not 10 minutes ago after wanting to throw up since 4am. I went to the bathroom a half dozen times to 'try' and couldn't throw up until my body was ready.

Now I feel slightly better. But yeah I couldn't just vomit on command even feeling nauseas and knowing I would throw up, just wanted it to be sooner rather than later!!!

Btw - Morning sickness is gross.

[Merla]

My 2 year old will do anything she can to avoid going to bed some nights, hungry, cold, hot, take her clothes off, I believe she could even purposely wet the bed is she was determined enough, however she can't vomit via sheer will power.

The babies that vomit in "protest" vomit because they have screamed for so long that they make themselves physically sick (which I have done before). My DD use to do this occasionally in the car (which she hated) where she would get so worked up crying and sweaty that she would vomit. It wasn't for attention or on command, it was a result of excessive crying and distress.

[share a book]

I was under the impression that it wasn't from distress but simply on command.

[Merla]

I was under the impression that it wasn't from distress but simply on command.

I don't know of anyone who can vomit on command. I thought it was from "protest crying" that they can sometimes vomit "in protest".

[*Need~More~Coffee~Please*]

I was under the impression that it wasn't from distress but simply on command.

Thats how TH likes to make ut sound i think , but yea as i said in pp its because of other issues ie being worked up and so upset

[Boobycino]

That's how I imagine it would happen - distressed, over heated, crying & then they vomit.

But TH apparently doesn't recommend letting baby get distressed...

Hmm :-/

[Merla]

I was under the impression that it wasn't from distress but simply on command.

Some babies are also just chucky, but I highly doubt they do it on command or by choice.

[share a book]

Thats how TH likes to make ut sound i think , but yea as i said in pp its because of other issues ie being worked up and so upset

My child has anxiety and vomits from distress when she's anxious sometimes if things are really overwhelming for her. Also she can't have too much animal milk (1/3 cup at most per day) or she becomes sick an either vomits or has diarrhoea or plain stomach aches that won't go away fast. If she has gluten it also causes tummy upset but she's never been able to vomit unless highly emotional or if she's eaten the wrong thing. Very rarely has she been sick other than that though so we're lucky in that way.

I wanted to know because so many people are now saying their baby or very young toddler can vomit to get out of going to bed. I wanted to know what age this could happen.

[Veritas]

Another who believes that young children can't simply vomit on command as a form of protest

Despite that belief, even if they could, young children behave in ways that ensure their needs are met, eg young babies cry if they are hungry, cold, wet etc. If a young infant is vomiting on demand it is clearly because on some level their needs, be they physical or emotional are not being met adequately and they do not feel secure enough to sleep. Young children do not have the cognitive ability for vindictive manipulation.

[the girls mum]

Probably completely unrelated - but if I cough enough I can vomit. In fact it is killing me right now as I have a bad cough and morning sickness - you get the picture.

Is that what you mean?

As for children? I dont know?

ETA - actually my almost 3 year old when she is worked up in a tanty - she will cough and then dry retch? I dont know if this is just because she has seen me do it though?

[share a book]

Probably completely unrelated - but if I cough enough I can vomit. In fact it is killing me right now as I have a bad cough and morning sickness - you get the picture.

Is that what you mean?

As for children? I dont know?

Can you make yourself cough then it makes you vomit? I tried that when I had morning sickness and wanted to vomit to feel better but never managed to. I hate morning sickness. Hope it passes for you!

[Boobycino]

Probably completely unrelated - but if I cough enough I can vomit. In fact it is killing me right now as I have a bad cough and morning sickness - you get the picture.

Is that what you mean?

As for children? I dont know?

ETA - actually my almost 3 year old when she is worked up in a tanty - she will cough and then dry retch? I dont know if this is just because she has seen me do it though?

I'm the same ATM, ive had a cough and I've been coughing till I puke. Very unpleasant :(

[shockinamillion]

I do not follow any books, but why w year old has figured out how to cough and make herself sick. Usually when she is cross or not wanting to eat it sleep. I have sat and watched he do it. She will glare, start coughing, then stop and say "sick" whether she managed to be sick or not. I do not. Think little babies do it though.

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[the girls mum]

Can you make yourself cough then it makes you vomit? I tried that when I had morning sickness and wanted to vomit to feel better but never managed to. I hate morning sickness. Hope it passes for you!

IF I feel sick then yes I can - ie morning sickness or hangover. Also say if I had a really horrible cough and didnt feel sick and just coughed and coughed then I sometimes will dry retch / vomit just because of the cough - but in saying that while brushing my teeth I will dry retch haha..




I'm the same ATM, ive had a cough and I've been coughing till I puke. Very unpleasant :(

Yeah it sucks - I have anti nausea pills but if I cough enough it still comes up. I hope yours passes soon - I am at the 14 week mark so surely????

[share a book]

IF I feel sick then yes I can - ie morning sickness or hangover. Also say if I had a really horrible cough and didnt feel sick and just coughed and coughed then I sometimes will dry retch / vomit just because of the cough - but in saying that while brushing my teeth I will dry retch haha..

Oh ok you have to feel that way anyway then?

[duckduckgoose]

I think it's sad that people think a baby is capable of such a manipulative act. If you think a baby is out to trick you then that is bitter and jaded and you probably go through life suspicious of everyone.

[RipperRita]

My 2 yr old ds rams his fingers down his throat to make himself vomit sometimes when he doesn't want to go to sleep. He also pushes and pushes until he does a poo and needs to be changed. Another of his tricks is to take off his clothes, nappy etc. *sigh* sometimes I really hate bed time. After I've changed his sheets, cleaned his vomit up, changed his nappy, redressed him he usually runs out of steam and goes to sleep. During all these antics he is never distressed or crying... It's all a big game to him and he finds it amusing. Thankfully 9 times out of 10 he happily goes to bed but *those* nights when he fights it are sooooo painful and I feel like pulling my hair out.

[Mummasprincess]

My friends 2 yr old has always slept with her mum but she tried her in a cot many times and she just cried then vomited. She would get her up and put her with her and she would be fine. I actually seen her do it from a young age, maybe 10mnths. If she was told no or didn't want to go to sleep she would cry (not a full on sad cry but more of a winge) and she would then vomit. I don't understand it myself, but after seeing that I think it may be possible but i couldn't see someone just vomiting without getting upset first? I don't get it. I actually seen her do it recently, woke up winging and crying a little and she was calming her down and when she tried putting her back to sleep she started gagging and we ran and grabbed a towel. I think it's something she does when she gets in trouble too. It's odd and I just find it really hard to understand. There may be other reasons behind it...

[Mummasprincess]

My 2 yr old ds rams his fingers down his throat to make himself vomit sometimes when he doesn't want to go to sleep. He also pushes and pushes until he does a poo and needs to be changed. Another of his tricks is to take off his clothes, nappy etc. *sigh* sometimes I really hate bed time. After I've changed his sheets, cleaned his vomit up, changed his nappy, redressed him he usually runs out of steam and goes to sleep. During all these antics he is never distressed or crying... It's all a big game to him and he finds it amusing. Thankfully 9 times out of 10 he happily goes to bed but *those* nights when he fights it are sooooo painful and I feel like pulling my hair out.

Wow that must be very tiring for you :( well you have a very smart little boy either way lol

[Benji]

Even if babies could magically spew on command they'd have to be pretty distressed in the first place to WANT to do it. I wouldn't vomit on purpose without good reason, these poor babes would have to be pretty desperate for their mum/dad to make themselves vomit on purpose :(

[peasmum]

I could be way off but from what I remember, TH talks about babies who have developed a vomit reflex (sortof) at bedtime because of controlled crying used in the past. So previously they have cried until vomiting, but now just vomit. I dont have the book anymore so can't check, but that's how I remember it.

[shinebrite]

Even if babies could magically spew on command they'd have to be pretty distressed in the first place to WANT to do it. I wouldn't vomit on purpose without good reason, these poor babes would have to be pretty desperate for their mum/dad to make themselves vomit on purpose :(

That's the thing hey?!? Like if your baby does anything to make themselves feel the need to do this clearly you need to try another tactic? I can't vomit on cue! In my teens I wished and WISHED I could but I couldn't! I tried! Is it that hard to just rock ur bub or lie down with them? I read an article a while back on adults suffering insomnia and the studied showed it was due to being CC/CIO. Clearly that sort of behavior is an act of 'frustration' ??

[share a book]

I could be way off but from what I remember, TH talks about babies who have developed a vomit reflex (sortof) at bedtime because of controlled crying used in the past. So previously they have cried until vomiting, but now just vomit. I dont have the book anymore so can't check, but that's how I remember it.

When they are littler they are left until they vomit but as they are older they know to simply vomit? That's to say that when are smaller babies they are left to become distressed to the point that they vomit then when they are older they don't need to be left to the point where they become distressed anymore to be able to vomit?

[peasmum]

When they are littler they are left until they vomit but as they are older they know to simply vomit? That's to say that when are smaller babies they are left to become distressed to the point that they vomit then when they are older they don't need to be left to the point where they become distressed anymore to be able to vomit?

I remember being a quite confused when reading this part if the book as it didn't quite add up ( as you've noticed too!) but I *think* it doesn't necessarily mean they do it on purpose.
ohh actually I give up, I have no idea

[the girls mum]

Simmingupstream - yes for me usually I have to already feel sick - however if i cough enough it seems to elicite a gag reflex from me which if happens enough will make me vomit.

My dd seems to be the same in a way - as in if she gets frustrated and worked up enough in a tanty she will then cough and gag / dry retch.

Maybe we are just strange?

FYI oh should add my dd has NEVER been left to vomit from crying in distress in her cot so I am not sure where this came from, perhaps as I said earlier its because I do it?

[RipperRita]

I've NEVER left my babies to cry to sleep. In fact I've been the naughty mum that has fed, rocked, driven, patted, co slept, slept on their floor.. you name it.. To put them to sleep. I can't stand crying.. It makes me incredibly anxious which is a personal issue I have. .... AND... My ds vomits to avoid going to bed... He vomits WITHOUT crying... So go figure that one out. My dd likes to have a bit of a release cry in my arms before sleep so she is a bit of a cryer but she doesn't vomit. So this thread is basically silly.

[the girls mum]

I've NEVER left my babies to cry to sleep. In fact I've been the naughty mum that has fed, rocked, driven, patted, co slept, slept on their floor.. you name it.. To put them to sleep. I can't stand crying.. It makes me incredibly anxious which is a personal issue I have. .... AND... My ds vomits to avoid going to bed... He vomits WITHOUT crying... So go figure that one out. My dd likes to have a bit of a release cry in my arms before sleep so she is a bit of a cryer but she doesn't vomit. So this thread is basically silly.

Yep my dd is the same... the longest she ever cried in her cot was 20 mins - and that was stopping, starting, whinging, stopping NEVER distressed and yet she is like me and coughs to bring on a gag reflex - more when tantruming - sometimes she even stops - looks at me, coughs gags, coughs gags, says 'Im sickles mummy' followed by 'i need a biscuit' - coughs gags etc.

[share a book]

I've NEVER left my babies to cry to sleep. In fact I've been the naughty mum that has fed, rocked, driven, patted, co slept, slept on their floor.. you name it.. To put them to sleep. I can't stand crying.. It makes me incredibly anxious which is a personal issue I have. .... AND... My ds vomits to avoid going to bed... He vomits WITHOUT crying... So go figure that one out. My dd likes to have a bit of a release cry in my arms before sleep so she is a bit of a cryer but she doesn't vomit. So this thread is basically silly.

ok then

[RipperRita]

ok then

:)
Moral of the story "yes" I believe my little rascal of a child has learnt to make himself vomit to avoid going to bed. Don't know why... Hope he grows out of it cause even though it doesn't happen often it drives me insane and I'm sick of cleaning it up. The little devil looks me in the eye, rams his fingers down his throat, vomits, then smiles at me and puts his arms out to be lifted up grrrrrrrr

[share a book]

:)
Moral of the story "yes" I believe my little rascal of a child has learnt to make himself vomit to avoid going to bed. Don't know why... Hope he grows out of it cause even though it doesn't happen often it drives me insane and I'm sick of cleaning it up. The little devil looks me in the eye, rams his fingers down his throat, vomits, then smiles at me and puts his arms out to be lifted up grrrrrrrr

Ok well I'm not sure why this thread is stupid. I asked what age they are when they work out how to do it on command without using fingers or being distressed or anything first.

[FloatingFairy]

If I'm crying and I mean a really good heaving/sobbing cry, if I dont stop early enough, I can vomit. I don't mean to and I certainly don't do it to stay out of bed LOL but I can do it and have alwasy been able to.

I used to do it to get out of class sometimes, however, not to be a rebellious school kid. I'd be crying from bullying and needed to get away from the bully and be by myself so this was a good way to go to sick bay without confessing that id been bullied.

Lol anyway :backtotopic:

When i worked in daycare, there was a little boy, under 2, who would vomit and poo every day at nap time.
Either coincidence that he felt sick from both ends at the exact same time every day, or somehow, he knew that when he did this, we'd have to go to him.

The way they dealt with it (which I do not agree with but was 16 and had no idea what was right or wrong) they would either leave him, or if they saw on the monitors that he was throwing his pooey clothes and nappies into the other babies cots, they'd go in there, take away all the soiled stuff, put a fresh nappy on him and move his cot into another room that was empty and leave him there to cry.

I hate it and would much rather have sat with him and read to him or something instead of leaving him but they wouldnt let me.

[MissPoss]

I've NEVER left my babies to cry to sleep. In fact I've been the naughty mum that has fed, rocked, driven, patted, co slept, slept on their floor.. you name it.. To put them to sleep. I can't stand crying.. It makes me incredibly anxious which is a personal issue I have. .... AND... My ds vomits to avoid going to bed... He vomits WITHOUT crying... So go figure that one out. My dd likes to have a bit of a release cry in my arms before sleep so she is a bit of a cryer but she doesn't vomit. So this thread is basically silly.

Ok, bit unnecessary to call the thread silly though. I think the OPs question was legit.

Out of curiosity, how old is your DS?

[the girls mum]

Ok, bit unnecessary to call the thread silly though. I think the OPs question was legit.

Out of curiosity, how old is your DS?

I would say that Dairyfreediva is feeling a bit defensive as some of the posts are hinting that in order for a child to do this they have to be very distressed due to being left to cry etc etc. I think she probably feels a bit attacked tbh (i could be wrong) but i think thats why she said she thought it was silly.

[RipperRita]

Ok well I'm not sure why this thread is stupid. I asked what age they are when they work out how to do it on command without using fingers or being distressed or anything first.

Well in that case. He started around 12 months. I think it was by accident at the start as he does have milk/soy allergy and had severe reflux as an infant and vomited in his bed a few times. Learnt that it meant I would get him up and now he does it occasionally when he is trying to avoid sleep. I thought this thread took a stupid turn when everyone started theorizing how it only happens to babies in control crying situations when clearly in my ds's case this is not true. I have read tizzy and while I don't practise cc as crying makes me anxious there is some value in her book. She has some great ideas for developing feeding and sleeping routines for babies of certain ages. When ds was tiny I would follow her sleeping and feeding routines (but rock ds to sleep or feed him instead) and he developed a great routine. I think with most parenting books, you read them and take what "you" need out of them. You tailor them to suit your parenting style. Again with attachment parenting. I like the premise of it. In fact a lot of my parenting revolves around following my children BUT I like routine so I do both.

This thread has some interesting comments but I thought it was getting a little too "babies only vomit if left to cry" and I disagreed.

Xx

[MissPoss]

I have no doubt a child, or an adult, can work themselves up so much they vomit. I do not believe a bay can vomit on command though.

Vomit as a result of being anxious and/or incredibly distressed, yes. Why let them get to that state though? I have 2 bad sleepers, the eldest I CC'ed. Guess what, she's highly anxious as a 10 yr old. My 1 yr old I have not CC'ed, she is a confident, very secure child. Coincidence? Maybe, but my instinct tells me it's not.

[share a book]

Well in that case. He started around 12 months. I think it was by accident at the start as he does have milk/soy allergy and had severe reflux as an infant and vomited in his bed a few times. Learnt that it meant I would get him up and now he does it occasionally when he is trying to avoid sleep. I thought this thread took a stupid turn when everyone started theorizing how it only happens to babies in control crying situations when clearly in my ds's case this is not true. I have read tizzy and while I don't practise cc as crying makes me anxious there is some value in her book. She has some great ideas for developing feeding and sleeping routines for babies of certain ages. When ds was tiny I would follow her sleeping and feeding routines (but rock ds to sleep or feed him instead) and he developed a great routine. I think with most parenting books, you read them and take what "you" need out of them. You tailor them to suit your parenting style. Again with attachment parenting. I like the premise of it. In fact a lot of my parenting revolves around following my children BUT I like routine so I do both.

This thread has some interesting comments but I thought it was getting a little too "babies only vomit if left to cry" and I disagreed.

Xx

I didn't say they did I was asking if that's what that person meant.

[RipperRita]

I would say that Dairyfreediva is feeling a bit defensive as some of the posts are hinting that in order for a child to do this they have to be very distressed due to being left to cry etc etc. I think she probably feels a bit attacked tbh (i could be wrong) but i think thats why she said she thought it was silly.

That's exactly how I feel as my ds doesn't even need to get upset to make himself vomit. He spent the first 12 months of his life being rocked, cuddled, fed, driven to sleep. He has never cried himself to sleep in his cot and yet he still makes himself vomit when he wants to get up..... Quite happily I might add. Like it's a game or something. he throws a few toys at me, calls "up, up" then if that doesn't work... Vomits. He also squeezes out poos (even though he's already done one for the afternoon) and yells out " mum, poo, up".

[share a book]

I would say that Dairyfreediva is feeling a bit defensive as some of the posts are hinting that in order for a child to do this they have to be very distressed due to being left to cry etc etc. I think she probably feels a bit attacked tbh (i could be wrong) but i think thats why she said she thought it was silly.

Ok but I haven't said that at all I was asking if that's what was meant by another post so why is this whole thread "silly"?

[trishalishous]

i cant vomit on command, without being ill or distressed (and even then i have no control over it)

[Mummasprincess]

Well in that case. He started around 12 months. I think it was by accident at the start as he does have milk/soy allergy and had severe reflux as an infant and vomited in his bed a few times. Learnt that it meant I would get him up and now he does it occasionally when he is trying to avoid sleep. I thought this thread took a stupid turn when everyone started theorizing how it only happens to babies in control crying situations when clearly in my ds's case this is not true. I have read tizzy and while I don't practise cc as crying makes me anxious there is some value in her book. She has some great ideas for developing feeding and sleeping routines for babies of certain ages. When ds was tiny I would follow her sleeping and feeding routines (but rock ds to sleep or feed him instead) and he developed a great routine. I think with most parenting books, you read them and take what "you" need out of them. You tailor them to suit your parenting style. Again with attachment parenting. I like the premise of it. In fact a lot of my parenting revolves around following my children BUT I like routine so I do both.

This thread has some interesting comments but I thought it was getting a little too "babies only vomit if left to cry" and I disagreed.

Xx

Well said!! And I agree with everything you have said. My dd has never done this but as I said earlier I know a 2 yr old who does, I don't understand it and prob never will. The 2 yr old that does this runs the house, is sometimes told "no" but that "no" is NEVER followed thru with, does what she wants when she wants, can take toys from other kids, hits other kids, yells until she gets her own way and can never be away from her mum so I think when on the odd occasion when she is told no (like in the middle of the night, and wants up) she winges and vomits cos she knows she will be able to get up? I honestly have no idea but that's how that situation looks from the outside. BUT your situation is totally different to that one. At the end of the day I think they are very smart little monkeys and they learn very quickly at this age. I hope your little one grows out of it very soon. You sound like your doing an awesome job! Xx

[the girls mum]

Ok but I haven't said that at all I was asking if that's what was meant by another post so why is this whole thread "silly"?

Sorry I didnt mean to say I thought thread was silly I just was commenting on DFD comment. Sorry, i definitely wasnt having a go.

Not sure but it seems some children can vomit / make themselves vomit when having tantrums etc even if they are NOT left to cry in cot. I dont know if its related but one of my friends toddlers holds his breath when having a tanty - for ages - its scary! But I would say MAJORITY of children definitely cant and especially newborns - they wouldnt even understand the concept. When a new born vomits I would say it is from distress / exhaustion from crying (unless they are a refulx bub and then I think they vomit all the time?)

Haha sorry I know that hasnt answered anyones question x

[Lemonhead]

I think I learnt from an early age. Its very useful now when I don't want to vaccum or do the dishes I can just vomit.

PFFT!

How silly. Tizzie Hall needs help, she seems to believe that babies are out to get us!

[Jakois]

IMO the majority of babies and small children cannot vomit on demand. There MAY be the odd child that can force themselves to vomit, but i would imagine they would have shoved their fingers down their throat to do so.
IMO the advice to leave a baby/small child in its own vomit to get them to comply with your sleep expectations is both outrageous and dangerous.

[Hootenanny]

I don't think babies can 'make' themselves vomit, I think they can get so upset that they vomit, I think they can get so anxious that they vomit, I think they can have physical reactions that make them vomit and I think they can have medical conditions that make them vomit, but I do not think they can make themselves vomit to get out of going to bed. As someone far more qualified than TH I disagree with any method that leaves a distressed baby all alone, I think you would be hard pressed to find an early childhood professional who would endorse that.

[peanutbrittle]

There is no 'age' that children learn behaviour that they know will get a response, it's as individual as any developmental milestone and as any other Childs upbringing, different to every child.
A child will quickly learn to laugh when they are happy, cry when they are sad,really cry when they are distressed and unfortunately have stronger physical reactions when left distressed with no comfort. There is some mindsets that believe that's these physical reactions can become learned behavior, in that the child learns that after an hour crying with no response, vomiting got a quick response, so next time why cry for an hour when you can cut straight to the vomiting! The theory behind it is actually correct, however I personally don't believe that 'vomiting' is a learned response. If we were talking about tantrums and breath holding, I would believe it, but not vomiting. Vomiting is a reflex not a voluntary action.

[elleandsam]

I can't vomit on cue, or soil myself on cue either. If I'm going to vomit it's because I'm sick or I'm incredibly upset.

My son spews, it doesn't bother him, but I clean him up before he goes to bed. It seriously takes me maybe 15 minutes MAXIMUM rocking him to sleep and then he naps up to 2 hours in his cot and does a 4 hour stretch before I bring him into bed with me for the night.

I cannot ever imagine leaving a baby to scream, spew or soil themselves. They cry because they need something and for a baby being with mum or dad is a genuine need.

[sahm]

I think the attitude in this thread is very interesting. "It's never happened to me, therefore it's a load of crap." My kids have never vomitted in distress or 'on cue' that I know of, but I think it would be short sighted of me to believe if it doesn't happen to me it doesn't happen to anyone.

[Benji]

I think the problem is, whether babies can do it "on command" or not is that these types of books advocate to leave the baby after they've just thrown up :( Whether it was "on purpose" or not surely babies deserve comfort after being sick????

[Jakois]

I think the attitude in this thread is very interesting. "It's never happened to me, therefore it's a load of crap." My kids have never vomitted in distress or 'on cue' that I know of, but I think it would be short sighted of me to believe if it doesn't happen to me it doesn't happen to anyone.


Babies simply do not have the capacity to vomit on demand, or are you implying that they can manipulate a situation when they are so young?
Babies are not small adults with the capabilities to read a situation and respond with an action such as vomiting. As a PP stated, vomiting is a reflex, not a behavior.

[elleandsam]

I think the problem is, whether babies can do it "on command" or not is that these types of books advocate to leave the baby after they've just thrown up :( Whether it was "on purpose" or not surely babies deserve comfort after being sick????

^^This!!

And how can a baby be expected to fall asleep when he's cold, wet and distressed after vomiting is beyond me. Not to mention a wet mattress gets mouldy after a while, don't want to be breathing that in.

[xkwzit]

I think never - no baby has the understanding of cause and effect that such a decision requires. I don't believe it happens at all.

There may well be many babies who get upset and throw up - but none of them made the strategic decision to do so. They are just really upset...:(

[Monster & Boof]

Maybe a little unrelated but my DS whom is now 3 learnt to vomit with no aid at dinner time when he was about 1... No aid I mean no fingers, food or anything else! I used to say try your meat,eat some peas, he would stick his tongue out and dry retch until he spewed... My 1 year old when he doesn't want to sleep will whinge but not cry and then he will poo just to get out of bed for a bit longer and sometimes even do it again once I put him to bed again like 10 minutes later - that has been happening since he was 8-9 months I think they learn the behavior that will get them out of something. Think about it they cry get your attention, if they poo they get changed, if they spew on themselves or in the bed it gets changed and I believe that they do learn things early! My opinion obviously but they know what gets them the attention they want!

[Hootenanny]

Yes they do! How the hell would peadatricians have adcibe on what to do for parents and why is there is a thread about it?? Why do you believe a baby isn't smart enough to put together that everyday Mum does the same thing, especially their cues for bed???

..........................................

Have you not cried ever in your life so much that you feel sick?? Does your child never ever cry about things that are so not worth crying about and get all worked up?? Has your child never had a crying fit/tantrum?? Or when your child cries as soon as you pick it up does it stop instantly??

No respected paediatrician would recommend you let a baby cry itself to sleep when it vomits. Every single pediatric society, mental health and early childhood association I have seen all warn of the dangers of cio and stress the importance of responsive trusting relationships between babies and caregivers.

If I ever cried so much that I felt sick I would hope someone around me would care enough about me to comfort me. My children do not have crying fits/tantrums because they have learnt that I listen to them and respond appropriately (not to say children who have tantrums have parents who don't), they know that I am fair and consistent. I also don't make a battle where there is none to be had.

[Pawzette]

I don't think many kids can do this.. however I do know of one kid that CAN!!! I used to baby sit a kid that if he didn't like something would throw up.. if he didn't want to do something he would throw up.. I have NO idea how he did it... lets just say I didn't baby sit them again...

I think the majority of kids cry so hard they throw up :( it is sad that some let their kids get that far.

And no if your kid is in the car and doesn't like their seat and throws up that is different. I mean people that leave their kids in their bed and they get so worked up they vomit. :( poor babies.

[the girls mum]

I get people have different opinions but does it always have to get so nasty?

[Roselight]

I don't agree at all that a baby should be left to cry, or scream to the point of vomiting. What negligence! But when a baby is doing this to you every night what would you all suggest? If you had to put yourself in their shoes what would you all do instead of jumping on all sorts of different subjects instead?

I'm sorry but I don't remember a single bit of it as I was 9 months! And is this meant to mean my relationship with my mother is bad because one night with the advice of a Pediatrician she left me for 5 mins in my cot? I have the best Mum, she is my best friend. I am very sorry that if the advice which my mum was given in the 80's (which I didn't even say for her to use) has upset so many people and has turned into a "You are a bad mother to let your baby cry"!!

[the girls mum]

Hugs roselight

[Roselight]

I asked this in another thread but haven't been answered and probably won't be answered so now I'm asking in a new thread.

It's about T i z z y H a l l stating that children learn to vomit and how many people leave them if they vomit.

I don't want a T i z z y debate I want to know when children or babies can learn to vomit to stall sleep time as in how old are they when they work it out?

Hi :wave: As a baby I did it at 9 months. My mum saw a pediatrician they gave her advice and it worked, this man is still a pediatrician. That's all I am going to say. I am going to delete my previous posts because I think this has gotten out of hand. I didn't come on here for this. I just wanted to give some advice on the matter but it gets nasty always.

[Azurial]

I asked this in another thread but haven't been answered and probably won't be answered so now I'm asking in a new thread.

It's about T i z z y H a l l stating that children learn to vomit and how many people leave them if they vomit.

I don't want a T i z z y debate I want to know when children or babies can learn to vomit to stall sleep time as in how old are they when they work it out?

I CAN vomit on command, never had an eating disorder, but learnt to do it during my binge drinking days..... yeah yeah..... I also had a boss who had her two year old in daycare 5 days a week, her dd could vomit on command and did so every day so mummy would come to get her. DD now has major teeth enamel problems form all the acid in the vomit. SO to answer your question with out getting into a debate Yes I do know of a child who could vomit on command and as a 'manipulation' for want of a better word.

[krystallxx]

My mum used to look after a boy (3) and he would make himself spew into his dinner so he didn't have to eat it if he didnt like it :| it was effing disgusting just quietly!
Anyway then he started doing it as a refusal to go bed. He learnt this when he was sick once. He spewed in the bed so of course his mum got him up and bathed and cleaned everything up etc .. Once he got better whenever he didn't want to sleep he would spew in the bed. Eventually he was left in until he was asleep and then cleaned.

[Nowhere]

my child vomited as soon as she started crying, many children are born with a weak lower osophageal sfincter and if they get air in there belly which happens when one crys they puke.

I dont control cry with my litle one but she has vomited loads of times while crying many in her bed in the car on my knee over my shoulder.

She has surgery when she was one year old to stop her reflux and she cried and vmited on the way back from theatre. She now has a drain into her stomach and feeds into her bowel so vomits a LOT less but still if she gets realy upset she vomits, she did this morning n fact she woke up about 3 am as usual and goes straight into screaming as she does, I went into her straight away and she was crying it then had to change her bum which she didnt want I led her down to do so and she cryed and spewed out of her nose poor thing. Then i finished changing her picked her up and brough her out here and put her in her chair she was fine i put her tray on and got her book, so i could go do a wee and while i was in there he started crying again, and i came out and she had puked all over her tray.

So yer my baby would vmit from crying and still can at 5 years old, I have never dne controlled crying but yer she still vomits when crying control crying or not we cant stop them crying.

So people can say im terrible because my child has vomited from crying, but any sugestions you have to stop her vomiting would be welcomed with open arms from my self and her entire medical team

[share a book]

Basically then the bottom line is that babies can vomit when they make themselves upset or when they simply become upset for whatever reason but when they are (example) 2+ they can learn it as a manipulation tool sometimes?

Nowhere you know mine vomits when she's upset too then sometimes passes out too but like you I've never left her to cry alone except in a tantrum I'll leave her on the couch til she calms herself then we can talk about options.

[AllYouNeedIsLove]

Ha Ha Lemmonhead! (page 5)
A few weeks ago DS was having nappy off time before bath and bed and did a nice big juicy poop on the hardwood floor... and then proceeded to stomp in it! I picked him up, handed him to dad gagging, and yes got out off showering the kid AND cleaning the floor!

I agree, vomiting can be a very useful skill!