What will you do with your left over embryos

[HeatherRob]

This a question that a lot of couples are left asking themselves.
I want to start a thread with all of your feelings on this.

Yes I am looking to be blessed but, I think it would be helpfull to those women who are left trying to decide what to do with thier embryos once they have their family. I can only imagine it would be a very hard thing to think about and maybe this thread could be helpfull.

[HeatherRob]

I hope everyone has a very happy easter.
And all your dreams and hope come true

[HeatherRob]

I have no shortage of egg donors and if I could use an egg donor I would then I would be well on my way to haveing a baby but, I need an embryo and that is where the problem lies.

So many women become attactched to those little ice cells. They think of them as a baby as a child.

Women worry that their children will feel cheated because their mum gave away their brother/sister.

They worry that any child born as a result of their donated embryos will come looking for them and will be angry for being given away or feel like they were abandoned.

.................................................. .................................................. ....

An embryo has the potential for life, the potential to be born, the potential to become part of a family.

Children do not think of an embryo as a baby, and as long as they are never lied to and always have all thier questions answered with honesty they are very understanding. You are the one who teaches them about what you have done and why you did it. They wont think you have given away their baby sister/brother, they will think you are very special because you helped a lady to have a baby.

Any child created from donated embryos in my family will be told the truth at an age appropriate time.
I hope to raise the child with the love and respect that would be deserved by the donor angel. They wont feel abandoned they wont be angry. I hope that they would in fact be very gratefull for being given the chance to be born.

I hope this answers any questions you may have I also hope this will help you to make the very hard decision about embryo donation.

[TNTbub]

I would gladly embie donate without any trouble, it would be an easy decision to make to give someone else the chance to have a child.

I personally wouldnt feel attached, nor would i look at it as somewhere out there is my embie or my child. It would be their child, they would raise it not me.

One major problem. I won't be able to donate left over embies as we are using donor sperm. Which i think is a crock, i would willingly donate embies. Damn govt rules.

Tntbub

[HeatherRob]

Yes it is a crock, I think that most of the rules and regs around infertility and dontation are all written by people who have know infertility problems.

I hope you reach your goal and have the family you hope to have.

[HeatherRob]

:fingerscrossed:

[HeatherRob]

I hope everyone had a wonderfull easter.
I hope you all have your dreams come true this year.
:flowerz:

[HeatherRob]

Well I have just helped couple number 4 to start their journey to motherhood.
It is nice to help others find thier donor angels and help them along the way but, I wish my angel would find and bless me.
Never mind it might happen one day, I just pray it happens soon.
I hope you are all haveing your dreams come true and have a wonderful pregnancy and a beautiful bundle of love in your arms.

[HeatherRob]

I ope those who have their bubs have a very special day today and those with buns in the oven, next year you will have a wonderful day.
To those still waiting it will happen for you just keep your faith and hopes alive.

[nicole83]

Hi Heather, it looks like you have made alot of posts but no one wants to chat :(

I just wanted to shed some light on your original post regarding embies and how women feel about them, it might give you a better understanding of how a woman with a frosty really feels (and take into account this is only me talking here about myself). I have one frosty waiting for me. It is day three, B grade. From the moment my DD took strength in our pregnancy, all I could think about what that frosty. I sometimes cry just thinking about it because I feel it deserves it chance at life and I am waiting for the right time to put it back inside me. I feel a huge sense of guilt to that embie, that it has been frozen and hasn't had its chance at life. Even if it doesn't take, I desperately want to give it it's chance. We suffer from MFI, and my DH was on alot of natural therapies prior to IVF. We were so lucky these therapies produced viable sperm. My mother-in-law has made comments, why don't you just start all those meds and see what happens? And the answer, to me, is quite simple, because my frozen embie deserves it's chance before any other potential babies are created (as much of a miracle that would be if we naturally concieved). So in my head, I have a thousand debates every day. We would be blessed if the other embie takes and we are a family of 4. But what if this isn't the case? What if we go through IVF again and have lots of strong embies? I can't answer that question now because I don't honestly know what the answer would be. My desire for another child will out-fight my fear of having "left over" embies that I can have. DH says we would put them all back and give them their chance, but we certainly can't afford and don't want to end up with 15 children. But can I honestly live with myself if I donated them? I don't think so. If I think and feel this strongly about 1 frozen embie, I would kill myself thinking about a potential child out there of mine.

When I read your posts, I get the feeling that you are hoping to find your donor embie on here. And I don't blame you, I would cover as many possible bases as possible too. But I don't feel this is the right place where you will find it. Everyone on here is fighting for their babies and after that huge emotional journey, many won't be able to put themselves through the tourmoil of giving up their babies. And yes, they are babies. If they were not, then we couldn't go back for cycle after cycle after cycle and have some hope when we get results.

I honestly wish you all the luck in the world to find your donor. Have you looked into overseas donations? USA? Asia? Do you need a donated embie or can you have a donated egg and donated sperm? If it were possible to have a seperate donated egg and seperate donated sperm, perhaps you would find more luck and it would be two completely seperate donations where those people have no connection to each other. All the best for the future, I hope your miracle baby is right around the corner :hugs:

[lilypily]

Nicole you have summed it up beautifully thank-you for your post.

[HeatherRob]

Hi Nicole, what a truely beautifuly written response. There were other responses written here but, the person who wrote them took them off, I am not sure why. So now it looks Like I am the only person ever to write in here for the main part.

I have a lot of friends, some very close friends, going through IVF so I understand that to some those little bunddles of cells are their children, we even have names for some, so yes I understand what you are saying.
We have had long deep meaning full conversations about the little ice babies. Some friends are now at peace with the choices they have made with reagrds to thier ice babies and some are still uncertain. No I wont take thier ice babies that isnt why I help them. As much as I want my child, my helping my friends comes first.

Some of my friends have had thier ice babies transfered at a time where they may not stick and they have let nature take its corse, 2 of them found that thier ice babies were meant to be. The others wernt, this might be a way to help some of you with your final choice if you find you have ice babies left.
I would give your last ice baby a go let it have the chance to live, then if it isnt to be then you could try the IVF again.

Thank you for your post, I do hope it helps others. I have found that there is little help and suport for mothers of ice babies and I feel that there is a lot of help and suport needed for those mothers.:goodluck:

[nicole83]

thank you ladies :) I just wrote exactly how I felt...

So HeatherRob, tell me more about your journey? I assume you have been through IVF to get this far? How have you been helping your friends get their babies - you mentioned this in another post??

Thank you for your advice regarding the frozen embie. We are looking at doing a FET in June to try to put it back...although my FS goes away for all of July so I am not even sure yet if he can fit us in, let alone all the dates fall in place so that he complete the FET himself. I don't want our only FET to be done by anyone else but him...so we are just waiting to see what happens when we meet with him in 2 weeks...trying not to think about it too much. "what will be, will be" - right?! and if we can't get in for June, then August it will be :)

[HeatherRob]

I have two threads in the donor section if youwant to know more about my journey, I realy dont think this is the place for my story to be written.

As for the help, I help my freinds to reach a chioce that they can live with, something that is best for them and their partner when they feel their family is complete. I tell them also that once they have made their decision that they must wait another 12 months before acting upon that decision to be 100% certain it is the one for them.

I asked my councelor what sot of help is there for couples faceing this decision and she recomended that the fertility clinic be contacted to see if an appointment with the councelor can be arranged. So not realy that much help unless they can do that free of charge.

:goodluck: to you all no matter where you are on your path to motherhood.

[HaileesMummy]

We were lucky and got our BFP on our first transfer (IVF/ICSI due to MFI) we are currently 37 weeks preggers and have 6 lil frozen embies. We have time to consider but I think about having them and what to do with them. We have DD(5) (not my hubbys) and another little princess currently on board! I know hubby would love to have one more but my body does not do pregnancy well AT ALL (had to finish work at 26 weeks) and oh I just don't know yet. I guess my scare is because I am perfectly healthy and get/got preg so easily if we tried again and got BFP on the first FET, then would I feel obligated to transfer the rest?? Aahhh!!!! I need to just concentrate on this bubba due to arrive VERY soon!!! Hugs. X

[Gardenia2]

I would gladly embie donate without any trouble, it would be an easy decision to make to give someone else the chance to have a child.

I personally wouldnt feel attached, nor would i look at it as somewhere out there is my embie or my child. It would be their child, they would raise it not me.

One major problem. I won't be able to donate left over embies as we are using donor sperm. Which i think is a crock, i would willingly donate embies. Damn govt rules.

Tntbub


I strongly disagree with this law. The govt is saying you cant donate rather they have to be destroyed -that doesnt sit well with me.

I am catholic and view life as starting at the moment of conception with a soul yes a soul we are not just cells.

So im all for embryo donation. We tried all of our embryos though. BTW even though IVF is a sin in my new religion, apparently it is acceptable to adopt an "snowflake baby" ie embryo.

so of course I am all for embyro donation. BUT I realise how hard that would be for a mother of a snowflake baby im not sure if id have that strength myself to be honest id like to think i would but it would be hard

I dont like the idea of embryos being donated to science or destroyed i am against that



Gardenia

[HeatherRob]

We were lucky and got our BFP on our first transfer (IVF/ICSI due to MFI) we are currently 37 weeks preggers and have 6 lil frozen embies. We have time to consider but I think about having them and what to do with them. We have DD(5) (not my hubbys) and another little princess currently on board! I know hubby would love to have one more but my body does not do pregnancy well AT ALL (had to finish work at 26 weeks) and oh I just don't know yet. I guess my scare is because I am perfectly healthy and get/got preg so easily if we tried again and got BFP on the first FET, then would I feel obligated to transfer the rest?? Aahhh!!!! I need to just concentrate on this bubba due to arrive VERY soon!!! Hugs. X

I bet you cant wait to meet your little one. I hope it is a nice easy delivery for you and a girl, DH would love a girl, he is terrible if we are in a shop we always seem to migrate to the baby department:eek: and he looks at all the pink stuff and I look at all the blue lol

It isnt an easy thing to decide and I have told many in your position to focus on your sef for now and then in 12mths time start to think about it take a long time to make any decision and then wait at least another 1or2 years before acting upon your final decision. I know many find it strange that a woman who is running out of time to find an embryo to have a child so badly want would sugest you take such a long time but, you have to be %100 certain you are makeing the correct decision for YOU.

I am curently awaiting the transfer on 4 embryos to my clinic from WA, my donor took 2 years to make her final decision and now she is more excited than I am about it all. Already to her they are my liitle ice babies and I have been accepted into her family in a big way. When it feels right you will know, my ED and I will remain firm friends now for life no matter what the outcome of the transfer. We talk almost every day and if we dont catch up we email, we have a lot in common and if we were to meet under different circumstance's we would still become friends.

[felicita]

re: embryos made from donor eggs/sperm.
It is my understanding that the inability to donate these embryos comes from the terms of the donor's informed consent. The standard consent is to assist a particular couple create embryos to use to make their own family. If the donor wasn't informed about other uses then they haven't provided informed consent to using their donation for that purpose so, unless you ask them, you don't know if they would still have donated if they knew that extra embryos would be donated to another family, and legally you're not allowed to assume.

Is it possible to approach the donor directly or through intermediary/clinic for informed consent to donate embryos created using their donation?

p.s. At our donor sperm (recipient) counselling today the counsellor confirmed that seeking the donor's consent to donate embryos IS an option.

[Paul64]

Hi everyone.

I'm so happy to have come across this thread at a time just when I needed it.

Wifey and I went through IVF a short while ago and came out the other side with the most beautiful, perfect daughter. She is now approaching 11 months. My little girl has changed my life in ways I never thought could be possible....changed my life in all the best possible ways. Our problem is, or rather my problem is I'm not a greedy person or a gambling person, but we still have two embryos on ice.

I was 46 when we began IVF and wifey was 40. We all know the risks to the foetus from being older parents. We've been blessed with one perfect girl and I’m terrified now, honestly terrified that if we use one of our frosties some disaster will befall the child. I'm not greedy and I've said to wifey that one healthy, perfect child is all I ever wanted. We were given that gift and I thanked God for that child many, many times since.

When I think of the many things that may go wrong now, my chest tightens, my breathing shortens and becomes shallow and the most awful thoughts run through my mind. I just can't do this, but I also find the thought of disposing of our embryos abhorrent. It makes me feel as if I would be destroying part of me, part of my family. When my daughter is older and we talk to her and explain about IVF, how would I tell her we disposed of the possibility of giving her a brother or sister?

This dilemma is bringing me to tears and keeping me up at night. I can't keep doing this. I wish we never had any extra embryos. When our FS told us we had two frosties in storage an alarm bell rang in my mind then and it’s been a major anxiety in my life since. Why couldn't they have just given us one embryo?

What do I do? I can't live like this. I really need some help.

Paul
SA

[HeatherRob]

Hi Paul, I feel for you. For so many people in your position it seems like there is no help but, there is. You could see if your IVF clinic has a councelor you can talk to.

[Melzey]

Just a warning, This is kinda going to be a long post. If you read it, Read it with a happy tone :D
I stumbled across this thread this morning, and felt compelled to respond. Which generally I don’t. If this is about helping people who have a decision to make about what to do with their embryo’s – I can write about my situation and how I made that decision. While I can’t help you HeatherRob, with your position (which it seems you may have an answer to, Congratulations :smiliedance:), I get the feeling from the way you have written your posts, part of this is about you trying to understand why people don’t donate more often, that, I can also write about from my own perspective..
Hi Paul, I agree with HeatherRob in that the clinic should have a counselor you could speak to they may be able to help you sort through your emotions, its definitley a tough dcision.. DH (who also refers to me as Wifey ;)) and I also have 2 bubsicles.. Since we went through our IVF in 2008, I have given countless hours of thought and done research into an answer for this question, just in case we are faced with this decision.. We hope to be able to have one more child, and given we have 2 embryo’s there is a chance we will have one left.
Scientifically, I know what they are – but emotionally I also know what they are, and let’s face it, they are the beginning of a baby, our baby. And whilst I understand there is plenty more needed for them to become that baby, without this start – the rest is not possible.
We were given three options;
A) Let them thaw out and “dispose” of them. This seems like an awful waste to me.
B) Donate them to someone else. Which we couldn’t do for various reasons (ill go into this more below)..
C) Donate them to research. This (for us), is the most likely scenario. I have become comfortable with this idea because I believe I would not have the beautiful daughter I have if it weren’t for people having done this before I needed to go through IVF.
HeatherRob, Firstly, Congratulations on finding your Donor! JJ I hope they get their act together and get those bubsicles to you soon.
So the purpose of what I write below. Is to respond to your statement HeatherRob, as to why “those little icy cells” aren’t something I could give away and (like you say) “so many women get attached to” (I would like to add that it’s not only women, Men also become attached to them). Neither of the examples you have given are what prevent me from being able to do this, there is far more to it.
You and I are on opposite sides of this very personal and emotionally charged situation (not like enemies, but 2 viewpoints that are likely to be different) and I truly hope I don’t offend you, but I do plan to be honest. I won’t say I understand how you feel, because I have never been in your situation and therefore, I dont.
What I can relate to, is really wanting a son or daughter. My body has had all the elements it needs to create a baby for at least 11 years in total (stable relationship, regular s3x, “normal” AF cycle, ovulation ETC. No PCOS or endo or anything that would medically prevent me from falling preg. DH with an above average sperm count) – yet, I have never even had a close call.
I agree with you in that “so many women get attached to those little icy cells”. I’m sorry to be blunt, but they are our “little icy cells” genetically; they are made up of pieces of me and pieces DH. After having DD, it really became clear what those cells were the start of.
What’s right for me, is not necessarily right for someone else. And what I say below is in no way a reference to how you might be as a parent, they are just concerns I have with donation of my bubsicles in general. To elaborate on the few concerns you mentioned, there is questions surrounding if I would want to stay in contact or do I not. Understanding that in some capacity, I would have to. Obviously there are considerations like what if my donation created a DS and my DD and the DS (who share Genetic makeup) met up later in life as adults? They would need to know all about who the other was and what they were to each other. Then, what if I disagreed with how the child was being raised, if the parents I had chosen for that child were too harsh in disciplining them. Or if I found out that child had been neglected or abused? They are not things that can always be forseen, and you never know what could happen. Just because someone really wants a baby, doesn’t mean they will necessarily be good parents, what if I chose the wrong people and they aren’t good parents..
Gardenia,
It’s interesting to me that in your religion IVF is a sin, but you can adopt the creation of the IVF? Isn't that kind of paradoxical?

[HelenHasTwins]

We donated our remaining 2 frozen embryo's after being lucky to finally fall after a long ivf journey with twin boys and then very lucky to fall with our little girl to our surprise naturally :smiliedance:

Our embryo's did defrost ok and were transferred but unfortunately did not take, I felt such heartbreak for the couple that recieved them, but I am very happy I tried to help someone achieve a family.

[happy dance]

Hi Paul,

I couldnt read your post and not respond.

I am currently 34 and was very lucky and have a 14 month old beautiful boy thanks to IVF.

As our journey was long and tough I thought I would just be grateful to have one child, however, since having my son I have wanted to at least have one more.

We had two frosties on ice which did not work so I decided to do another fresh cycle. To my suprise we had a great fertilisation rate plus I am currently 14 weeks pregnant with my second.

The other factor to consider is I have 7 frozen embies. When I found out we had so many I had similar thoughts to yourself and thought it would have been easier to have no frosties and a postive result then a postive with frosties.

I can totally appreciate you weighing up the risks of using your embies and your wife falling pregnant at 40+ and it seems you have come to the conclusion that you dont want to take the risk with an FET and possibly change your family dynamics and quality of life.

I am also concerned about the health risks of this and any future pregnancy and I am only 34 years.

I am sure you have had some long discussions with your wife about what is the best decision for you, your wife and your family. I have briefly spoken to DH about our options.

At this stage I am really uncertain if we will use our remaining embryos (for a number of reasons) so our only other options is to donate to another couple or donate to research.

Personally I am more then happy to donate to another couple (however I have similiar views to Melzey about the repercussions of potential abuse etc). As it was such a long journey for me I want to help someone in a simalr situation. My DH however is very protective of his embies and does not want to put them in harms way with another couple. So I need to accept his opinion and we need to make a decision that we can both live with.

My only other option it to donate to research. If they can be used to improve the success rate then at least my embies may have helped more then one couple???

As I am so undecided as to what to do with my remaining embryos I will keep them on ice until I am confident I have made the right decision.

I think anyone who has frosties is faced with the same fears and concerns as yourself so you are not alone. What ever decision you make will be the right decision.

[Paul64]

Happydance, Helenhastwins, Melzey and HeatherRob.

Thanks so much for you opinions, advice and sensitivity. I think I need to take some time out with the councillor from our IVF clinic and go over with them my fears and concerns. I've allowed myself to get into quite a state over this and the time has come to speak with an experienced person in these matters.

Thank you so much again.

Paul
SA

[Gardenia2]

thats great news that you can ask for consent for these embryos to be given a chance at life