Using 'the teething mixture' to get bub to sleep

[minay]

Hoping for some advice here...

Since 4 months old my daughter stopped sleeping through the night

She got her first two teeth at 6 months and at 8 months she has just got 4 teeth through in ten days

Thus I have not slept in weeks!

My friend gave me a bottle of 'the teething mixture' which is a mix of paracetamol and trimeprazine (apparently an antihistamine like phenergan) to zonk her out for the night. She buys it in her home town in Ballarat but it is apparently not available in Brisbane.

I have tried researching this on the net and found little, other than that phenergan is linked with SIDS (yikes!) and trimeprazine has been used successfully to treat sleeping problems in young children.

My friend says that it is commonly used in Ballarat (apparently 4 mums came and asked for it in 15 mins whilst she was talking to a friend).

Has anyone ever used it or heard of it?

I have used it a few times in desperation as I work and cannot function with the 4 hours a night my darling is allowing me

I feel absolutely terrible for doing it, but I refuse to do the controlled crying/comforting thing (and I am not knocking anyone who does use it :o ) and don't know what else to do.

Last night she went down at her usual time of 6.30pm, woke at 7.45pm, 9pm, 11.30pm, 2am, 3am, 4am and got me up at 5am. I can usually get her back to sleep within 15 mins just holding her or giving her a bottle, but being woken so many times is doing me in. I even put her in bed with me if she wakes after 12, but she is still waking and crying...

She has had a molar under the surface for the past 3 months, so I guess that could be part of it...who knows!

Sorry for the long essay - any advice, comments etc are welcomed

[Emily's moocow]

Apparently now in some places if you go into your chemist or doctor and ask for Phenergan or something to knock your baby out for the night they report you for child abuse. I know this sounds extreme to some but it is actually harmful if not used properly. The baby cannot wake up thus there is the link to sids.

I have an almost one year old who wakes frquently throughout the night and gives me minimal sleep she has been doing this for nearly 8 months. So any suggestions would be really helpful too.

Teresa
Mum to Brock, Jacob and Emily :)

[draught]

My 10 month old is a frequent waker but slowly with some modified controlled crying techniques we are getting there. I find that consistency and learning to listen to her different cries has helped. If she is in distress then some cuddling and patting to sleep is in order. If she is just grizzling and fussing then I leave her to put herself back to sleep and she now does it in under 10 minutes usually. I read something sensible once that said that if you constantly aid your child to sleep because they are teething you will be aiding them non-stop for 3 years as they have teeth growing the whole time. I know that you don't want to use CC - several people on here have referred to a book about no-cry sleep options - that might be of assistance?

I don't know how to write this without causing offense but am curious to know why you are opposed to controlled crying but not opposed to sedating your child to sleep? (Genuine curiosity not judgemental curiosity, if that makes sense?!)

[mimi]

Hi petemin

Before I get onto the "teething mixture", I just wanted to mention that there is information to say the 'teething' is not actually the big, bad ogre we are all led to believe.

Teething often coincides with the age that babies loose the immunity they received from their mums womb [around 6 months], so all manner of viruses etc hit. Also, when the salivary glands of infants begin functioning and contribute to constant drooling [3-4 mths], parents may misinterpret this as a manifestation of teething. Babies of this age can also put their hands in their mouths, and another normal developmental event that is attributed to teething is normal night waking [6-9 months].

It is accepted that things like temperatures, diarrhoea, rashes and smelly urine are not caused by teething, but of course we cannot ask children if they have any PAIN with teeth eruption. Research says there is little evidence that they do [and indeed many kids do sail through 'teething' without so much as a whimper] but I think it would be foolish to say outright that teething does not cause any pain!! Mums for years have been saying it does, and many bubs may well suffer!!

From your description of the night waking, I was wondering if there could be some other cause though ... ear infection? tummy pains from food intolerance?? maybe? Earache is always worse at night as the pressure increases in the ear when they lie down. Of course most ear infections require no more than paracetamol as pain relief for a few days, but rare cases may require antibiotics too. Dr Sears says that the biggest cause of night waking is actually dairy intolerance ... but eliminating cow's milk could be quite diffiuclt if bub is on formula! unless of course it is soy or something ...

If you do believe that bub is suffering with teething pain [and this could well be so] I would think that paracetamol [panadol] on it's own or even baby ibuprophen [Nurofen] would be better than the mixture you mention. If it is pain she is suffering then the medicine willl help - without the risks of the added meds!

Anyway I have rambled on enough - hope things get better for you soon!!
:)

[BJelly]

Have you tried bonjela?

It's a kind of local anaesthetic gel.

I've been using it and alternating it with baby panadol to help my baby sleep for the past week.

The great thing about bonjela is that it works almost instantly - the first time I tried it, bub practically fell asleep in my arms - she must have been so tired, poor thing :o .

I think the only reason not to use it is if your baby is on any aspirin based medications. It's got an aniseed/licorice type flavour.

Best of luck - I know what you and bub are going through.

[funnyfarm]

My daughter was waking every 1/2 - 1 hour all night for about 3 weeks at around 7 months old I assumed teeth aswell. Previously she was a very good night sleeper. She was miserable during the day (I assumed because she was so tired) and just generally cranky. After 3 weeks I had enough and took her to the doctor and requested a urine sample for a urine infection and HEY PRESTO, it came up positive. Once treatment for this started to work, she was a new child. I have heard that when you go to places like tresillian, the first thing that they test your children for is a urine infection to make sure that is not what is keeping them awake.

Just a suggestion but It could be the answer to your problems.

Janet
Mother to Briana Sage (2.6.04)

[mimi]

...I had enough and took her to the doctor and requested a urine sample for a urine infection and HEY PRESTO, it came up positive. Once treatment for this started to work, she was a new child...
Exactly! The main problem with blaming teething on everything is the possiblility of missing a serious illness! Those who have researched this subject have been saying this for a long time, and thankfully, some health professionals are actually 'getting it' too!

[clairbear]

I agree with all the things the previous mums have said, guess it's just trial and error working out the real cause and what works best. I would be too scared to try any phenergan type medication. When my two year old was little, I tried some of the BRAUER brand herbal calm formulas....got them at my local chemist. They come in a range.....teething, sleep, calm etc., can't remember them all. They are homeopathic type remedies with ingredients like lavender and chamomile. I found them really good when teaming them with controlled crying.....seemed to make the experience much easier with less crying. I helped my son through any rough patched with sleeping and now that he is two and two months I am happy to say he's been an excellent sleeper for most of his life TOUCH WOOD! :p
Good luck, I know it can be very stressful :)

[minay]

Hi everyone

Thanks for your input

Re the child abuse thing - that totally freaked me out - I was talking to a friend today who used to work at a chemist and she said that certainly doesn't happen in QLD - not to say it isn't valid or happening elsewhere.

Re the drugging but not cc thing - I guess it comes down to the crying - using the teething mixture means she is asleep and my heart doesn't have to break a million times over - she knows she can get me to do whatever she wants if she cries and while I am as tired as I am, I am taking the admittedly easy option and knocking her out. The three times I have used it, I did so planning to get a good nights sleep and then starting to try the cc thing but one stretch of 6 hours sleep in a month only gets me to stop having a complete break down...but don't get me wrong, I feel as guilty as hell and reading these responses makes me feel worse.

Re the doctor thing and lactose intolerance thing - sounds like a great idea. I actually read about babies moving from the birth-6 month tin to the 6 month+ tin getting lactose intolerant, so I might try that and also book us in for the doctor.

And re everything else (!!) I have tried:
- bonjela
- panadol
- neurofen
- brauers
- cold washers/flannels
- baby massage

All before going to this mixture!

I am going to book in for the doctor next week and we'll see how that goes. I have heard there is a sleep school in Brissie somewhere so I might look into that too - it is just so darn hard working, studying and looking after my darling.

Any further comments/suggestions are welcome and I really do appreciate all who have contributed so far.

Thanks

Melinda

[draught]

It sounds like you do need some help - and I have heard mainly good things about Riverton here in Brisbane where they will help you to teach your baby to sleep, and support you at the same time. Your GP is a good place to start for a referral there.

I have a friend who has been in a similar position to you except that her son was 20 month before they got help. She was often going to her high pressure professional job on less than 20 minutes sleep :eek: . She couldn't bear to listen to her son scream or cry and they were in a hopeless cycle of him ending up being too tired to sleep. They ended up getting a 'supernanny' type person who came to the house and helped them work out a routine for their son, and the whole family is now much happier and healthier. They went this route as he was getting a bit old for Riverton and it was Riverton that gave them the name of the woman who helped them. My friend's main advice is to not wait as long as she did to get help - your life will be very different once the baby is sleeping. The only warning I give you is that you may have to listen to her cry initially, but I understand that Riverton give you support and choices and don't make you do anything you aren't ready to do.

Good luck and sleep wishes for you both

[mimi]

I feel as guilty as hell and reading these responses makes me feel worse.... - it is just so darn hard working, studying and looking after my darling.
Hi Melinda

Don't feel guilty! You are obviously a very caring and loving mum - and looking after a baby/child is one of the hardest jobs in the world to do, let alone having to study and work outside home as well!!!! Today's societal expectations for a mum to care for her child with little outside help is totally unrealistic, and this is when/where many mums come unstuck - it takes a villiage and all that! :)

While giving bub some 'teething mixture' might not be the ideal thing, the way you describe the situation, it is obviously not anywhere near child abuse! and I think you should first 'forgive' yourself for being human and wanting some sleep, then move on to getting some help for this impossible situation - and it appears this is exactly what you are planning to do.

Looking into possible illness, food intolerance, separation anxiety etc etc hopefully may find you answers, but may not too - babies are compex little bundles that we still don't fully understand!!- but hopefully the search will find you some solutions!!

Wishing you all the best - and we will be awaiting the updates ... hoping for good news of some restful nights for your family!!

:)

[melzy]

I just thought you might like to have a look at the www.cyh.com.au website. It's the child youth and health website and if you go to the topics column and select A-Z topics, there is a section there under teething and teeth care. There is some great reading in there which might assist you and it also tells you info on the medicines you have or wish to try and what they do etc.

Also, when you go to the homepage there is an icon about 2/3 down on the right hand side that says parent helpline and you need to click onto that. Once you have clicked on it will give info on SA and the helpline number there but if you scroll down a bit further you will see other helpline numbers for each state, including Brizzy for you. They give you advice on absolutely ANYTHING.

You mentioned about going to a place that assists in sleeping. I went to a place called Torrens House which helped me out and they are BRILLIANT. We went in when my daughter was only 7 weeks old and didn't have a sleep routine etc and we walked out of there 3 days later like a new bub and mum. You may need a referral from your paediatrician to get into this place or local doctor but you can also ask the doctors/nurses on the helpline number about it and they may be able to refer you to someone.

Teething and having unsettled nights suck hey - if only they could talk and have a full set of teeth at birth (not too pleasant for breastfeeding though!!) :D

All the best, I do hope my bit if info helps you out.

[minay]

:cool:

Well things are certainly improving around here - I am so glad I took some action - and thanks to those who shared their views.

I started by taking my bub to the dr - he checked for ear infections and pee infections and then we discussed milk protein and lactose allergies. All came back clear.

His advice was to try controlled crying (which I of course baulked at).

I held off for a week or so but finally decided to give CC a go - but my way

At night, I bath her and give her a bottle, then put her down. I only stay away 1 min then 2 mins then come back in and stay with her until she is asleep.

I think a key element was my darling hubby who stood next to me the whole time and gave me kisses and hugs when I needed them, and stern words when he could see I was waivering. Getting through the first night was tough!

The first night it took 40 mins, but since then it takes no more than 5 mins - mind you it has only been 4 nights, but things are looking great. Daytime sleeps are a breeze now too - and longer.

Today, I found this excellent website http://www.swsahs.nsw.gov.au/karitane/docs/sleep.asp

which provides several methods for getting bub to sleep - and more in line with my comfort levels.

Why the turnaround? I am sure many of you are asking... sheer desperation is my only answer.

My husband commented after the 2nd night that I was laughing and smiling for the first time in months - that really hit home what a bad state I was in.

So I guess my message here is - do what feels right for you - but also be open to try new things.

If anyone wants to know more specifics about my approach, I am happy to go into more detail by email or here if you think it's a good idea.