Child Assylum Seekers

[MrsMiggins]

I was listening to the Hack program on Triple J this afternoon (an excellent program if you've never heard it - well worth tuning in for), and they had an interesting story about the governments proposed new plan to process assylum seekers on a boat off the mainland of Australia. The story was addressing how there were concerns how this new plan will affect children seeking assylum.

Now before I go any further, I have to admit to being appalled at the way Australia treats assylum seekers - particularly children, so be forewarned that my views here may be more sympathetic to those seeking assylum in Australia, but in saying that, I will never be close-minded to any arguments.

The story highlighted the story of a couple of different refugee children. The one that stuck in my head the most was that of a teenage Afghan girl who's grandparents smuggled both her & her younger brother out of Afghanistan in order to save their lives. These children ended up as just two of the thousands of unaccompanied children who arrive in Australia seeking assylum.

The story highlighted concerns for such children if the "boat plan" were to go ahead & what would happen to these children in this system of "processing" refugees.

I think it raised some very valid issues. Personally I can't understand how politicians (many with children of their own) can turn these poor little souls away when they have come to Australia seeking their only chance of refuge.

When I hear their stories, I can't help but think what if I were in the same situation? Would I not do anything & everything within my power to save my precious children from the horrors of war, torture, killing, rape, murder & violence? Would you do any less to save your child if it were your only chance?

I'd love to hear other's views on this topic - the ramifications of the government's proposed "boat plan" and on children seeking assylum in Australia in general.

And I hate to think it would need to obligitory reminder to "keep it nice"!

[the_queen]

I think it's disgusting to even suggest keeping refugee's on a boat until their status is determined. It can take up to 4 years, as has been the case for some unfortunate people!!

It really annoys me when the general public doesn't have more compassion for these people. They've either been conned and decieved by people-smugglers (therefore they are innocent victims) OR they're fleeing for their lives from a society that is so different to our own that we can't even begin to imagine what they've been through.

[MrsMiggins]

I agree with you there Queenie.

Whenever I hear people comment that the refugees should all just be sent home, it makes me so sad. I guess in a way, it is good in that so many people who live here in Australia have never had to experience living a life so terrifying that they have had to fear for their lives & for that of their loved ones (especially their beloved children) on a daily basis, but I just can't believe that there are people who cannot muster compassion for those who's lives are an endless living hell.

[SassyMummy]

I too think it's quite disappointing that Australian's are becomming so uncompassionate.

In a way, I guess the "boat" idea doesn't surprise me. It seems that, as the years roll by, everyone is getting more and more concerned with their own personal "rights" without considering anybody else. In some cases (IMO), ignoring others is a good thing (eg. breastfeeding in public...without caring what anyone else thinks)...but in some instances, it's just plain rude and inconsiderate (occupying a bus seat when a pregnant woman is standing for a minor example).

I don't really understand how Australia can have a national anthem which really has nothing to do with how our nation actually is. ("We are one...but we are many...and from all the lands on Earth we come...we share a dream...and sing with one voice...I am, you are, we are Australian..."). You'd think we'd be willing to be "neighbourly" and accept refugees...

If your nextdoor neighbour (even if you didn't know her very well) knocked on your door with nothing but the clothes on her back, and said, "I had to leave...I have nowhere to go...I was in fear of my life living there..." would you say, "Okay, well...just wait on my lawn while I think about it..."??? :rolleyes:

I guess though, with all the "terrorism" cr*p going on, you do have to be a bit wary as to who you let in.

Back to the next-door neighbour example...what if the majority of your neighbours started rocking up at your door looking for help? Soon, your money would be going towards them...and your own family would be missing out...and who knows if Number 42 is a good guy or not..?

While I think, overall, it's a stupid thing...I can SORT OF see why they'd have to do it...they can't just let EVERYONE in...

[Mamaduke]

I don't really understand how Australia can have a national anthem which really has nothing to do with how our nation actually is. ("We are one...but we are many...and from all the lands on Earth we come...we share a dream...and sing with one voice...I am, you are, we are Australian..."). You'd think we'd be willing to be "neighbourly" and accept refugees...

First of all that's actually not our national anthem...our national anthem goes a little something like this...


Australians all let us rejoice
For we are young and free
We've golden soil and wealth for toil,
Our home is girt by sea:
Our land abounds in nature's gifts
Of beauty rich and rare,
In history's page let every stage
Advance Australia fair,
In joyful strains then let us sing
Advance Australia fair.

Beneath our radiant Southern Cross,
We'll toil with hearts and hands,
To make this Commonwealth of ours
Renowned of all the lands,
For those who've come across the seas
We've boundless plains to share,
With courage let us all combine
To advance Australia fair.
In joyful strains then let us sing,
Advance Australia fair.


Now back to the topic at hand.
We simply cannot just let 'all & sundry' in.
I do agree that these people are obviously coming here to start a better life, and we live in a very lucky country (I mean all we have to whinge about really is fuel prices, that's how spoilt we are!) but...
by jumping the queue and coming here illegally, isn't that taking time and resources away from people who are going through the correct lawful channels?
Just because these people have the money to pay someone to smuggle them (and it's not cheap), what gives their situation any more urgency &/or credibility than the next family who may not be able to afford the 'people smuggler'?
Every case for asylum should be looked into carefully and properly - it can't be first in best dressed...wait your turn!

[SamanthaJane]

Hmm... i agree with Mamaduke :yes:

[pookiesossige]

How can you 'jump the que' when in the country that you need to escape, there IS NO que- many of the people seeking our refuge come from countries without an Australian Embassy.

I think that our treatment of asylum seekers, children in particular, is disgusting.

Thinking about children seeking asylum- my mother bought me a short book as a 10-year-old called "Onion Tears". It was shortlisted by those children's book awards (you know, they have a big silver sticker on the cover) and it is a lovely story about a a girl who escapes persecution with her grandfather in a tiny boat. She left behind her parents and little sister. It is a gorgeous story that is totally appropriate for children and can help plant the seed of compassion that most of us want in our children's approach to people less fortunate. I still have my copy. It is beautifully written. Highly recommended :thumbsup:

[Pippi Longstocking]

I guess it depends on the way you think - globally or locally. I tend to think globally. I don't think we have a right to feel threatened, to carry on about how "they" are taking our resources etc.

Why can't we "let all and sundry in"? Don't we have a responsibility to care for fellow humans? Why are we more entitled to the privileges Australia offers? How is it that we can tuck our little full-bellied warmly-clad western kids into their nice warm beds knowing that there are hungry sick kids sleeping on leaking boats? Why aren't they our responsibility? Are you human? Are they human?....well?

[jessgray]

there are two ways to look at this:
one way is that its disgusting to hold any person on a boat practily captive for undetermined amount of time which i belive could go against human rights.

another way to view this is, if our goverment gave a compasionate hand to all the people who came to our shores to live here, and they let them wouldnt you think we would have a sudden influx of aslylum seekers?

i think the current system to migrate to australia is a bit whacked anyway, my fmaily friend is expecting her first child and her DP is from south africa and he wants to be here for the birth and 3 times he got rejected for a visa coz he didnt have a sponsor :( but now he is coming here in november :D

[MamaSage]

Firstly, PMSL @ Staceys national anthem! :laughing: :laughing:

I tread carefully here. My partner had worked at Christmas Island on the refugee camp, so I have seen first hand some of the cruddy conditions that these people live in. It's pretty bad. IF they are to be detained, they are to be detained in a reasonable level of comfort. NOT a boat. All people have the right to basic levels of comfort and care.

But, like other pointed out, out country, although large, simply cannot support all those who decide to just rock up here. Consider our unemployment rates, cost of housing, cost to the govt of supporting refugees. We do need to draw the line somewhere - the issue id finding a fair line. And as Mamduke said, many of the people who are in detainee centres are the rich people from their countries. They have often paid big bucks to get on that boat. I am sure there are far more needy people in that particular country then a lot of these refugees.

[MrsMiggins]

While I do think that there are people out there who wish to abuse the system and "jump the queue" so to speak (not that I totally agree there is a queue in existence, but that's an argument for another day...), I think that the vast majority of people entering Australia illegally (ie, not able to apply for visas to enter the country) do so because they have no choice. Also, the original topic of this thread was regarding unaccompanied children as assylum seekers & refugees.

Imagine you are a young woman living in Afghanistan, your husband was taken away 6 months ago by the Taliban or Mujahadin & was likely totured & killed. You have 3 small children and a 12 year old daughter. You haven't seen your own family in years and don't even know if they are alive. An elder in the village who already has 3 wives is coming tomorrow to take your 12 year old daughter away to be his 4th wife. You are poor and have no way of making a living and spend your days begging on the streets just to scrape enough food together so that your children can have a couple of mouthfuls of food in the evening. You can't remember the last time you yourself ate a proper meal. While begging on the streets for food, you have been beaten & raped on more than one occasion.

The sound of bombs & gunfire, while a constant backdrop for the past several years, has been drawing nearer in recent weeks and last night every person in a house in your village was killed when a stray bomb struck it.

A distant relative of your husband, whom you trust takes pity on you and tells you that while he cannot help you, he can take your children and ensure they are safely taken away to a country where everyone is free & they will never live in fear or go hungry again. But they must leave tonight.

What would you do?

Can you tell me that people living in conditions such as these have the luxury of applying for visas? Or that an illiterate young woman would even know the process of applying for a visa?

And to say that Australia cannot afford to take in refugees... why then are we paying thousands of dollars to women for each child they produce? Is this to say that the government has a hidden "White Australia" policy that it has dredged up from the 1950's?! Is the government saying that our children are better than immigrant or refugee children??

[Pippi Longstocking]

When people hear the words "illegal immigrants", they automatically think of leaky boats filled with Indonesians when in actual fact, most illegal immigrants in Australia are backpackers that have out stayed their visa. In the period between 1999-2000, 58,748 people overstayed their visa and became illegal immigrants, compared with the 4,175 people who arrived by boat....that's 7% of Australia's illegal immigrant population.
I wonder why the media isn't concentrting more on the real problem? Hmm, mayhaps it's because the majority of illegal immigrants in Australia are actually good caucasian folk....:rolleyes:

[SassyMummy]

:laughing: PMSL at myself and my WRONG national anthem!:laughing:

I feel like such an idiot...I can't believe I, for the moment in time that I wrote that post, thought that THAT was the national anthem...! :laughing:

Anyway...sorry for being such an idiot...I wish I was pregnant and could therefore blame it on some sort of pregnancy brain...

[the_queen]

Norah, that is such an interesting point, I hadn't realised those statistics. I guess the media is just interested in "what gets ratings" rather than the actual problems, what is actually happening.


It's a difficult issue, I can understand the government wanting to properly screen newcomers to our country, particularly considering the current political climate around the world - but come on, if a terrorist is going to come to Australia, why on earth would s/he get on a leaky boat and come here like that?? A student visa, or something like that, that makes much more sense!!

[reAllytee]

This is a hard one thats for sure & i certainly hate the idea of people being left to live like this too it breaks my heart to see it.
At the same time i went to school with many people who fled their countries due to genocide etc yet they went about it the "right" way so to speak who managed to get into this country via the right channels. Guess who can really say what is the right channel when your fleeing for yours or your childrens life though.
But the thing that does bother me is half of these people possibly dont have identification because they are trying to hide something. There are the known "villians" so to speak found in many of our detention centres who have no papers & i really wouldnt like to see them in our society just because they need asylum.
Its just very very hard i know this is one thing i often get caught in when thinking about the day i become PM :laughing: Yes i think of that day & yes it would be scary for many of you :p Its such a hard issue though really really hard !