breastfeeding to a schedule

[MothersMilk]

This may be a dumb question but i am curious...
I was recently at a mothers group and every mother there breastfed there newborns 4 hourly. I fed my DD whenever she was hungry which was more like every hour or two - i kinda thought that 4 hours was a bit of a long stretch for a newborn but i was looked as a weirdo hippy for not having done the 4 hourly thing.
I mean one baby was screaming and sounded very hungry but mum was like 'she isn't hungry until x o clock and that's that'.
Anyway i was just curious is it common to feed like this and if you do is it just to set up a routine or is your baby just not hungry that often?? :o
Hope i'm offending anyone here - i just hadn't come across this before and was wondering about it :)

[Mrs Nietzsche]

I find it really weird to be honest and wnoder how healthy it is (not to mention supply issues, etc)

[Hollywood]

I have always fed DS on demand.....ESPECIALLY when he was newborn! The only baby I knew who was BF on a 'schedule' is now fully FF, because 'surprise surprise' the mum's milk dried up :rolleyes:

[dreamtobeamummy]

I plan on demand feeding.. bub will soon tell you if they are hungry or thirsty :)

Ive never really understood the whole schedule thing either :confused:

[Hollywood]

I plan on demand feeding.. bub will soon tell you if they are hungry or thirsty :)

Ive never really understood the whole schedule thing either :confused:

lol, yes, you'll know! They tell you by crying :D though at the start it can get a bit confusing when you don't know the difference between the "I'm hungry" cry and the "I'm tired" cry. But you work it out eventually :yes:

[MothersMilk]

Oh good - to be honest i found it all a bit odd but wasn't sure if maybe i was just the weird one.

[dreamtobeamummy]

lol, yes, you'll know! They tell you by crying :D though at the start it can get a bit confusing when you don't know the difference between the "I'm hungry" cry and the "I'm tired" cry. But you work it out eventually :yes:

Definently.. I agree with ya 100 percent there :D Its all a learning game

[MothersMilk]

I did wonder about supply also - i mean surely it would be affected?
Oh well each to their own.

[kezzaskids]

everytime my babe opened her mouth to make a peep I offered her a feed!

[Hollywood]

I did wonder about supply also - i mean surely it would be affected?
Oh well each to their own.

Yeah, I think in the first 12 weeks it is important to demand feed. After that, they probably have a bit more flexibility, once the supply is established.

[2girls&1angelboy]

i demand fed i fed dd until 15 months when she decided she didnt want it anymore from 4 months it was expressed at work every 2 hours but when i was home if she wanted to feed every half hour 15 mins then she was fed never went by x amount of hours even when dp ooked after her when i was working if she wanted the expressed milk 4 times in an hour or whatever she got it, she isnt over weight or anything

[IndigoJ]

Maybe they think they have to feed every X amount of hours because thats what you do with formila.

I demand fed but bub was a reflux baby so wanted to feed every 15min. So i put him on a 2hr routine and tried to limit his feeds any earlier than that (it did happen a few times but his reflux was worse after i fed him) Then after his reflux settled down (at about 2.5mths old) then he made himself a 3hr routine and when he was about 4mths he made himself a 4hr routine. Though most times he didnt even fuss for a feed so i would have to remember when his last feed was and feed him 4 hourly.

[JabberJaw]

Its a more old school way of feeding babies. When i had eldest DD (almost 13 years ago) the way you fed was 10 minutes each side every 3-4 hours. WHen i left hospital they gave me a chart that i wrote down when i fed her, how long for, which side first etc...i then took that to the CHN each week when i got her weighed.

THings have changed thats for sure, and now i just fed on demand for as long as bub wants. SHe only ever fed from one side at a time, and sometimes i felt like i fed her all day, others she fed 3-5 hourly. I never had to chart anything, and i certainally didnt go to the CHN for weigh ins each week either! As a matter of a fact bub 4 has never been to the CHN, just the GP who checked her weight and growth.

[BigRedV]

I demand fed with breast, EBM and formula :confused:

made sense to me.

In fact, when the midwife visited when I left hospital, she asked how many feeds baby was having a day. I said I didn't know, that I didn't count, I just fed her when she was hungry. She said "what a breath of fresh air."

I don't get schedule feeding at all TBH.

[AM]

Of COURSE their supply will be adversely affected, this is why the bf rates in OZ are so $hit!!!! Outdated crappy information.

Demand feeding here all the way, even if it is every 20 minutes. (or less...)

It's my job to supply the boobs, and trust my baby's inherent intelligence completely. They are SMART little cookies!! :D

[Erin21]

if your child is hungry or thirsty feed him...thats how i see it.

[The Fox]

Oh God i feed DS all the time even when his not hungry lol, if he cries even its because he is tired i feed him, boobies are used to fix everything here lol
I actually dont know how people get by scheduling feeds, what do they do when bubs is upset or cant go to sleep, Gosh i even pull over and feed DS if his hungry

[Sheer Bliss]

It's actually not bad for the baby on the surface of basic nutrition) to be fed 4hrly, but in most cases it's not what the baby wants, so from an emotional POV it's not always best for the baby.

All of my babies were on 4hrly scheduled feeds for the first month or so of their lives.....they were all also born from 35-36weeks, which can need different treatment to a healthy FT bubba! Our paed reccomends 4hrly feeding and having bub awake for no longer than 45mins (including nappy changing and re-settling) UNTIL bubs starts demanding - then he fully supports demand feeding. And after speaking to the nurses in the SCN, the babies under his and the other paeds that do 4hrly feeds gain weight much faster than the 3hrly ones. He also suggests pumping for 10-15mins after baby is alseep to help establish supply - so IMO that shows that such long gaps isn't believed to be great for your supply.

So.....I DO prefer to demand feed, and IMO it is better for baby, and better for your supply, but in the case of really small/prem/pre-term babies - scheduled feeding is GREAT!! My babies may have suffered otherwise, as they didn't wake for feeds at all!! Now, at 7months the twins go anywhere between 1-5hrs with their feeds.

Just to add something different too....only one of them is demand fed....sort-of.....to keep them in the same 'routine' (not timed, but yanno, doing the same things at the same time as each other for the sake of my sanity!!) When one demands a feed, the other gets fed too! Which usually means DS2 is demand fed, and DD2 just goes along for the ride.

[Opinionated]

In fact, when the midwife visited when I left hospital, she asked how many feeds baby was having a day. I said I didn't know, that I didn't count, I just fed her when she was hungry.

Same. Whenever I was asked I never knew. I only know now because we are down to morning and night with the occasional snack through the day.

[Annabella]

I fed to a loose schedule. I fed roughly every 2.5-3 hours, my babies would never have lasted 4 hours, and I wouldn't have tried as I think that is too long for a baby to go without a feed. If I felt my kids were hungry before they were 'due' for their next feed I would feed them but would always offer another form of comfort first to see if that worked as I didn't want my breasts to be the only thing I could use to comfort them. I think sometimes they cry, not coz they are hungry but because they want comforting, which often takes the form of BF. This way worked really well for me, they both weaned themselves easily (DD1 at 13 months and DD2 at 16 months), I never had supply issues, they both slept well at night and both took EBM in a bottle easily. So schedule feeding is not all bad, as long as you are willing to deviate from it if you need to.

[Little-Pink-Hen]

The mchn both tried to get me to schedule feed four hourly and than two hourly it didn't work for us both Lilly and I became very distress I was on the verg of pnd :no: lilly wasn't putting on any weight :(
I listened to my bub and instincts with support from the aba councilors, bubhubbers and my fantastic new MCHN :D :D :D
the old mchn were upset I couldn't tell them how often how much and when the last feed was as I was feeding on demand now that I tried schedule feeding I can truly know that it's not for us

[Little-Pink-Hen]

everytime my babe opened her mouth to make a peep I offered her a feed!
Yep I do this you can tell that sometimes that she wasn't hungry prob just wanted a cuddle but she is hugly greatful I'm giving her extra milk lol her little eyes are like omg this is like Christmas

[~Temet Nosce~]

Seems a bit odd to feed 4 hourly with a breastfed bub, bm digests alot quicker than formula, generally a ff bub can last 4 hours. I do feed my ds 4 hourly (formula) and sometimes he does get a bit hungry before it, but due to his reflux it helps him tremendously to go 4 hours between feeds so that he doesn't have too much in his tummy coming back up etc. he is much more unsettled when I feed him any more than that.

[BabyPaparazzi]

I never understood scheduled feeding either, to me a baby doesnt take note of the time on the clock, they let their belly and brain tell them how often and how much they want to feed.

To me if it is broke fix it, I dont know how some put up with the drain mentally and physically of trying to force a newborn work to a clock.

On a slightly different note, knowing some FF babies I was always amazed that the mothers would follow the back of the tin like it was the bible. They would make up the set amount of formula and once bubs was finished it then that was it, even if they were screaming 15 minutes later, 'they cant want anymore cause thats what they should be having' ???? To me a baby doesnt know that it is being BF or FF and I was always taught that they will take what they require, so doesnt that mean that a bottle should have something left in it?

I think there is a lot of misguided information and a real lack of correct information sources available to woman these days and it is a shame.

[MsMummy]

I've never heard of scheduled breastfeeding. Sounds like archaic rubbish leftover from the 1950s.

[~Temet Nosce~]

I never understood scheduled feeding either, to me a baby doesnt take note of the time on the clock, they let their belly and brain tell them how often and how much they want to feed.

To me if it is broke fix it, I dont know how some put up with the drain mentally and physically of trying to force a newborn work to a clock.

On a slightly different note, knowing some FF babies I was always amazed that the mothers would follow the back of the tin like it was the bible. They would make up the set amount of formula and once bubs was finished it then that was it, even if they were screaming 15 minutes later, 'they cant want anymore cause thats what they should be having' ???? To me a baby doesnt know that it is being BF or FF and I was always taught that they will take what they require, so doesnt that mean that a bottle should have something left in it?

I think there is a lot of misguided information and a real lack of correct information sources available to woman these days and it is a shame.
it actually says on the tin that it is a guide only and baby may need more or less than is shown.

I usually always make up the next amount in age, just in case ds wants a bit more, even if it is only an extra 20 ml or so. The MCHN said I was silly for doing that, because of all the wastage.. but meh, it keeps my baby happy I don't really care about the extra money, and he will be drinking more eventually anyway.

[MummaBear03]

Whenever people tried to tell me to put my baby on 4 hour feeds, I'd respond with "Do YOU go 4 hours between food or drinks, including meals, snacks, coffee, tea, water, softdrink and everything?" and usually that made them think. If an adult doesn't go 4 hours between any food or drinks, why should a baby have to?

[~BEXTER~]

I never got to BF Keiara after a few weeks old, I will try to do it this time but I now know the signs of it not working so wont push it as long as I did with Keiara.

So I do have a question if BF works this time round BF is based on demand feeding only?

Keiara was fed every 3 hours on formula so I figured BF was the same thing, This may sound stupid to all that could BF but I always thought BF bubs were fed every 3 hours too.

[MummaBear03]

I never got to BF Keiara after a few weeks old, I will try to do it this time but I now know the signs of it not working so wont push it as long as I did with Keiara.

So I do have a question if BF works this time round BF is based on demand feeding only?

Keiara was fed every 3 hours on formula so I figured BF was the same thing, This may sound stupid to all that could BF but I always thought BF bubs were fed every 3 hours too.

Mine was roughly every hour or hour and a half and sometimes fed for up to 45 minutes, but sometimes only fed for 10 minutes. There was no rhyme nor reason to her feeds, just like there isn't when I have anything now. If I'm hungry there's no reason not to grab and apple, if I'm thirsty there's no reason not to have a drink of water. Sometimes she was hungry and sometimes she was thirsty. She fed more through the summer months because I guess she must have been thirsty more because of the hot weather.

[~BEXTER~]

I did demand feed Keiara when she was born.
she would feed for over a hour then want more under a hour later. I never had any milk so she will just tire herself out from sucking.

[becca022]

I've always demand fed my 2. Ds was ff from 3 weeks & we fed him on demand & dd is still breastfed on demand at 14 months. I believe that if their hungry feed them. We used to be friends with a couple who fed by a schedule & she would be screaming for a feed, but they wouldn't give her a bottle because the 4 hours werent up yet. It used to break my heart listening to her.

[Hollywood]

I did demand feed Keiara when she was born.
she would feed for over a hour then want more under a hour later. I never had any milk so she will just tire herself out from sucking.

DS did that too, heaps in the beginning, but I learnt eventually that often it was a comfort thing. Cluster feeding is very normal in newborns, they do sometimes want more an hour after the last feed. By about 12 weeks things have usually sorted themselves out (as i discovered) and they go longer between feeds.

[Sunnygal]

See I was told to feed for 20 mins, 4 hourly by a CHN when I had my first, I was young, didn't have much info on breastfeeding so took her at her word - of course it stuffed up my supply, i thought i wasn't making enough milk because he would cry for more between feeds and breastfeeding went downhill from there until we stoppped at 3 months! :no:

Looking back now I realise how foolish I was not to trust my own instinct I mean seriously a baby has such a tiny belly, and breastmilk digests so quickly, how on earth can a baby be expected to last 4 hours???

This time around I trusted myself and we are still going at 2 yrs old :goodvibes:

Sorry didn't mean to go on a rant! I just wish people knew to trust themselves instead of taking another persons word as gospel!!

[garfield13]

I bf on a routine from birth with dd, more like 3hrly, and we had no problems & it worked well for us - I never let her go hungry, if she was ever hungry I would feed her, but this wasnt often as she was fine on the routine feeds. I know 3 other people who have done routines bf from birth and all worked well for them too. Each to their own, for me I enjoyed having a routine

[lozie2]

i bf to a very flexible routine, i use to feed her 3 hourly unless she woke and asked for it (cried) earlier. she was having small weight gains, she is now 6.5months and is bf 4 hourly with 3 meals. she is gaining heaps of weight. each to there own...
but if mine was screaming id feed!

[NonnyMouse]

I BF on demand for the first 6 months or so, but now am on a rough 4hrly schedule because he was snacking too much and not hungry enough to give it a good go, which meant he climbed all over me, got distracted, took ages to get a letdown, and generally was a huge pain!

Now that I drag it out to around 4 hours between feeds he drinks a decent amount in a sitting, is more content, and fusses less at the breast.

I do still give him feeds in between on a really hot day or if he's being extra clingy and seems to need it, but generally the 4 hrly feeds sit well with him. (And having rough times that he's due for a feed makes it easier for me to keep track of when I fed him last... with my present baby brain it's far easier to remember "6, 10, 2 & 6" as feeding times than try to think when it was that he last fed.

[SuperGranny]

Hi, I do get a little bothered when I see remarks about "old information from the 1950s'. I know there is more modern thinking out there, but that is no reason to just discard other methods that have proven to be successful in days gone by. We cant all operate on only the new information, and toss aside other ways from even my grandmothers generation. I have demand fed all my children, and they seemed to set a three to four hourly routine for themselves. I was told ten minutes each side and three hourly gaps, and that is what I started out with, and then it became whatever the babies wanted. I was not given the information as the absolute only way to breastfeed, but it was given as a guide, to start with. I think we can all benifit from what ever information is available, regardless what century it comes from. Marie.

[Areca]

Hi, I do get a little bothered when I see remarks about "old information from the 1950s'. I know there is more modern thinking out there, but that is no reason to just discard other methods that have proven to be successful in days gone by. We cant all operate on only the new information, and toss aside other ways from even my grandmothers generation. I have demand fed all my children, and they seemed to set a three to four hourly routine for themselves. I was told ten minutes each side and three hourly gaps, and that is what I started out with, and then it became whatever the babies wanted. I was not given the information as the absolute only way to breastfeed, but it was given as a guide, to start with. I think we can all benifit from what ever information is available, regardless what century it comes from. Marie.

With all due respect it's outdated because it proved to sabotage many breastfeeding relationships. The fact is that the majority of newborn babies feed much more often than every 4 hours. So for all the mothers of your generation who's babies didn't last the 4 hours, or fed longer than the 10 minutes each side were told there milk wasn't of good enough quality, or that they simply didn't have enough. The truth is only 5% of women CAN'T breastfeed. Since you were raising your babies they have realised that this information is indeed outdated. It's not an attack on the way your generation fed your babies, it's that with more research they discovered that feeding for 10 minutes each side every 4 hours was simply not the best advice and was sabotaging a lot of breastfeeding relationships that would have been fine otherwise.
I don't ignore the way things were done a generation or two ago, so long as the information is there to back up that is a good thing to do. Making a bf newborn go 4 hours between feeds and then timing them on their feed is not a good thing to do for the most part.

[SuperGranny]

Hi Areca, I understand where you are coming from, and I can agreed with you. Perhaps the way the information was passed on was not the best, but it was never said to me that you must do this or else the breastfeeding wont work. The information was meant to be a guide, and a starting point, if there is no starting point how does one know what to do at all. I can understand that methods change, and it is all to do with communication. I think it is more important to tell a new mother some guidelines, to start with, and then work from there, not to just disregard old ways because they are 'old fashioned'. I think all new mothers need the information, but they also need encouragment, and support from others to know that what they are doing is fine and it will work out eventually. Marie.

[Areca]

As someone who attended a breastfeeding class they do tell you to disregard the 'old 4 hourly routine our mothers knew' because they now tell you to offer the breast first pretty well every time. They make sure that everyone knows this information is outdated. With growth spurts and every baby being different it's just better to offer the breast every time until you get to know your baby better...they also teach you the difference between actually drinking and comfort sucking so that you don't become a human pacifier but so the baby gets to drink for as long as it takes them. It's very important that babies get both the foremilk and the hindmilk and by timing them you risk jeapordising that if they aren't a quick feeder.
I understand where you're coming from in other aspects of parenting but when it comes to routinely feeding a breastfed baby the information is outdated and old fashioned. Sorry but it just is. It's not an attack on your generation at all....I feel sad for my grandma (two generations ago) who fully believes she had no milk because she ate apples every day simply because her babies weren't happy to go 4 hours between feeds. If I had been given that advice I wouldn't have been able to feed any of my babies but following the 'new' advice of demanding feeding I've successfully bf my two daughters until they were 14 months and 18 1/2 months and am successfully bf'ing my 6 week old DS. None of them have stretched to 4 hours until they started solids, which was at 9 1/2 months and 11 months respectively.

[Annabella]

In response to the little debate going on above ^^^^...

I think both ways have their merits. I personally think 4 hours is too long between feeds, but as someone who successfully BF on a FLEXIBLE 2.5-3 hr schedule (if baby was crying and I felt it was because they were hungry I would feed them), I know first hand that this way can and does work for many people. Its good as it means you can roughly plan around feeds and look for other reasons baby is crying not just hunger.

I think demand feeding is good as it means baby gets fed every time they are hungry without mum thinking its too soon for a feed or whatever, and it is good for milk supply. However a lot of new mums really struggle having baby attached to them constantly, including at night, and I think this is a reason a lot of women don't keep going with BF. Many times when a baby cries, they may not be hungry, but want comfort, and BF is a source of comfort, but there are other ways too.

I don't know what BF rates were when the four-hour routine was the norm, but they're pretty crap now so I don't think either can really be blamed for poor BF rates. The 'old' way worked well for a lot of women back then, and the 'new' way works well for a lot of women now. I think its good to take parts from each and work out what works well for you and your baby. I couldn't have gone 4 hours b/ween feeds, but I would've given up if I'd had a baby BF every hour or so on demand...

[MsMummy]

Hi, I do get a little bothered when I see remarks about "old information from the 1950s'.

There's a whole school of thought from the 50s to the 70s which is just absolute crap.

My poor mother-in-law lived through the tail end of it. She said that the hospital staff took the babies away and put them in nurseries, encouraged routine feeding, starting solids at 6 weeks, discouraged breastfeeding if the baby "wasn't thriving".

[Areca]

In response to the little debate going on above ^^^^...

I think both ways have their merits. I personally think 4 hours is too long between feeds, but as someone who successfully BF on a FLEXIBLE 2.5-3 hr schedule (if baby was crying and I felt it was because they were hungry I would feed them), I know first hand that this way can and does work for many people. Its good as it means you can roughly plan around feeds and look for other reasons baby is crying not just hunger.

I think demand feeding is good as it means baby gets fed every time they are hungry without mum thinking its too soon for a feed or whatever, and it is good for milk supply. However a lot of new mums really struggle having baby attached to them constantly, including at night, and I think this is a reason a lot of women don't keep going with BF. Many times when a baby cries, they may not be hungry, but want comfort, and BF is a source of comfort, but there are other ways too.

I don't know what BF rates were when the four-hour routine was the norm, but they're pretty crap now so I don't think either can really be blamed for poor BF rates. The 'old' way worked well for a lot of women back then, and the 'new' way works well for a lot of women now. I think its good to take parts from each and work out what works well for you and your baby. I couldn't have gone 4 hours b/ween feeds, but I would've given up if I'd had a baby BF every hour or so on demand...

Yes but imagine being told that you could only feed your baby every 4 hours and that if they were hungry after 2-3 hours it was because you didn't have enough milk/your milk wasn't good enough because for a lot of people that is what they were told. It's bad advice and outdated. They didn't allow any leway for growth spurts etc. I loosely keep an eye on the times my babies have fed, I find by the time they get past the 6 week mark they get their own bf'ing routine going so it makes life easier. But it's their routine thet suits them. That's what they are teaching now, offer the breast all the time, let them finish on that breast before offering the other side, and let them make their own feeding routine....tailor made to suit their needs.
Some of the advice from a generation or two ago was crap, feeding to a strict 4 hour schedule was one. I bet by the time our babies are having babies there'll be more research done on certain topics and it will make what we do 'outdated and old fashioned.' It's not an attack on us personally, just that with more evidence the 'rules' change. Often my mum comments that she wishes that the research had been done and the knowledge was out there for her generation. She would've done some things differently but like she says 'we did the best we could with the knowledge we had.'
I think it's important to look at the big picture, and not take it as a personal attack on one generation's parenting techniques.