View Full Version : Circumcision
I know this is a touchy subject, but what are your opinions??
I can not make up my mind. I hav done my research on the pro's and cons and so far everything on the net that i have read has said this:
*Circumcised males are 'cleaner', less prone to STIs and UTIs, have a smaller risk of penile cancer and of carrying the disease that causes cervical cancer.
I have been told off a couple of people that this is actually not true and that uncercumcised males are less prone to diseases and cancer as they have a 'protection'.
But i am yet to find any info supporting this argument, on the net.
I personally think circumcised 'looks' better but i also doubt whether it's necessary because it is natural and must be there for a reason.
Please-any opinions or info would be much appreciated.
~BEXTER~
13-10-2009, 21:43
There have been a lot of these lately and they always get heated people get hurt and they get closed.
You should do a search in bub hub and read the ones already out there.
sockstealingpoltergeist
13-10-2009, 22:03
Check out JohnC 's threads debunking those myths.
It does put your baby at risk of harm from the procedure. Also if they want it done when they are older they can allways choose it.
I personaly wouldn't circ my son due to my own personal sexual preference. It is also good to remember that only about 15% of boys are circ'd these days, therefore most women will see uncirc'd penises.
:)
Littlemissmetal
13-10-2009, 22:09
Wasn't for us, DS1 isn't circ'd and neither will DS2
The few "pros" there are for circumsizing were no where near good enough for us to put our son's through unnecessary pain. If it was needed for A medical reason it would be A whole different reason though. My boys can make that choice later in life if they wish to be circumsized. Goodluck with your decision, try speaking to those in the pro cir and anti cir threads as I am sure they will be able to offer you more advice and knowledge.
CatNoonan
13-10-2009, 22:11
We haven't had our son circumcised as we believe the forskin is there for a reason.
My husband still has his and has never had a problem with infections
BabelFish
13-10-2009, 22:48
We won't be doing it. No need to as far as we're concerned.
We wouldn't circumcise our daughter, we won't circumcise our son.
My husband isn't c'msised and all the boys from his side, but my dad, brothers, some cousins are. Neither have had problems, except one of my cousins who wasn't and had to get it done around 10 years old because of an infection, but that is quite rare, and I wouldn't do it to my son just on that slight chance. Less risk of diseases etc.? What are the chances of your son really catching something because he's not circed as opposed to just good hygeine and safe sex? No one really knows, that's why there is so much for and against. If it was a definate medical reason, everyone would be required to do it imo? I think in the near future it'll be illegal, I don't know but I think that's where it's heading? When my son was born, it was never asked by a doc or discussed, I just don't think they do it or support it?
For aseathetic reasons, I personally don't think it makes a difference, and most guys love their penises no matter how they look! I just wouldn't go there, it's not like you would give your child a nose job as a baby because you think it looks good, sounds silly but I think it's the same thing.
I say leave the poor penis alone :laughing:
Good on you for asking questions :thumbsup:
Personally, I wouldn't circ my son.
I don't like the fact that some people do it because it looks better or for their own sexual preference, or because daddy is done.
A boy isn't going to be standing in the showers with his dad after playing sport and as SSP has said, only about 15% of boys are done these days. I think body image is imprtant to both female and male teenagers and think it could potentially be very embarrassing for a boy in a team to be the only one who doesn't have a foreskin. And boys do compare.
I don't take taking panadol, just in case I get a headache. I wouldn't chop a foreskin off, just in case it was going to get infected. Also, circumcision *might* reduce the incidence of HIV. But does that mean your child can go and have sex without protection when he is older becuase he thinks he won't catch it? I know I would rather teach my children about safe sex, because there are plenty of other STI's out there, not to mention unwanted pregnancies etc.
Good luck with your decision.
Check out this section of bubhub for more info:
http://www.bubhub.com.au/community/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=164
I left this decision up to my DH, it is easier for him to make that decision as he has that part of body. My opinion on this subject could only really be based on look and what is written by others, so it is not really objective.
At the end of the day we have decided to leave it as is unless there is a medical reason it needs to be done during birth. IMHO surgery is still a surgery even if it is "minor" so why put a healthy child through it when it is not necessary. I am not against it or pro it but at the end of the day that is decision that we felt was best for our baby.
I was asking the same questions not long ago. I posted in the circumcision section of bub hub and got absolutely savaged by some users for even considering it. Some were just downright rude, and while their posts were often removed or edited, I saw a few of them before the mods must have and it was awful. I can't beleive that they are allowed to remain bub hub users in some cases. Other users were really supportive and helpful but I found the bias still ran too strong for my liking, it just didn't seem balanced, logical and reasonable. I hadn't realised it was such an emotional topic for some people.
Previously, I'd assumed I'd have it done because the boys in both mine and DH's family are. But I looked into it and decided against it.
The two "selling points" for me were that I thought it must be really sore when that raw skin is exposed to a wet nappy surface, and that the health benefits of having it done are really rather minor particularly if it is being properly cleaned and looked after. If it is medically necessary, we can always have it done later. DH and I disagreed on it for a while but I encouraged him to speak to other recent fathers (his brother, mates etc) and at first he approached it defensively, almost as though the idea of not doing it was a criticism of his body and his mother's choice, but soon changed his tune without me hounding him. He says now its just one of the many things that have changed a lot since our parents had us.
But its a decision for you to make as a mother, like many to come. Don't be swayed by some of the more fanatic opinions, listen to the ones you relate to.
I wish you the best in making this decision!:hugs:
WorkingClassMum
14-10-2009, 08:48
Chaton - that is a very wise post :thumbsup:
Not because you decided to not circ, but because it's a very balanced post. I am sorry that you experienced such a baptism of fire very early in you Bubhub experience.
To the OP - good luck on your decision - this is a very emotive subject.
I didn't get my son circ'd and am very anti-circ - I just can't see that it's necessary to fix something that isn't broken and don't accept the possible limited benefits outweigh the risk of surgery.
Good Luck
This is a tricky one but the basic fact is this, you will find just as many pros as cons & just as many people claiming its cleaner as there are those who disagree with that.
In the end it comes down to personal choice.
TheCatsMeow
14-10-2009, 09:57
I'm pro circ and I would be circumcizing my son if I were to have one. I did the research, and I agree with it. My view was neutral to begin with and after doing a lot of reading, it is a procedure I support.
My advice is do your reading and do it from all sorts of sources from opinions on forums like these to medical journals and everything in between.
Don't let anti circ/pro circ comments confuse you either. At the end of the day - you have a son, and you have the right to make an educated choice. Good luck!
kezanazz
14-10-2009, 10:04
I have been told off a couple of people that this is actually not true and that uncercumcised males are less prone to diseases and cancer as they have a 'protection'.
But i am yet to find any info supporting this argument, on the net.
.
i dont have a pro/anti argument here... just wanted to say not to base your decision on something you find or dont find on the net...a lot of what you read isnt actually fact its someones opinion dressed up as fact... at the end of the day would you trust a drunk in a pub says??
a lot of websites have as much scientific/medical value as doing just this!
Awesome another circumcision thread, these never get old.
chickpea
14-10-2009, 10:07
I*Circumcised males are 'cleaner', less prone to STIs and UTIs, have a smaller risk of penile cancer and of carrying the disease that causes cervical cancer.
.
FYI the Gardasil vaccine can also be given to boys which stops them contracting and spreading the human papiloma virus which is linked to cervical cancer. So, your son will be able to get vaccinated (if you are a vaxer) to reduce that risk.Of course this is assuming sexual preference, but even so the papiloma virus is linked to other cancers anyway.
My advise is talk to a few GP's to get proper medical opinions & don't read all the anti/pro circ threads on BH as they are full of campaigners that will tear you to shreads whatever your opinion is!!!
summamummy
14-10-2009, 10:48
We will be getting our son circumcised, It is our choice and we have done our research on pros/cons. Each to their own with this debate, It is alot more risky and painful for an older child/adult to have the procedure done. We want our son to look like dad aswell and feel very strongly about this. It is such a touchy debate but a choice that only the parents can make.
This is actually the first 'debate' I've ever seen regarding circumcision, in Ireland it's never done unless the parents are jewish (a very small minority of the irish population)or there's a medical reason so to me, any debate is purely cultural.
If there was any legitimate medical reason to have it done at birth then I'm sure it would be more widespread than it actually is, although I do find the claim that it's cleaner to be a bit ridiculous. An uncircumcised penis can be just as clean, it all comes down to personal hygiene.
Like PP's said, I wouldn't circumcise my daughter or have cosmetic surgery done on a baby just because I think it looks better so why would I circumcise my son?
pinkishbunny
14-10-2009, 11:21
My advise is talk to a few GP's to get proper medical opinions & don't read all the anti/pro circ threads on BH as they are full of campaigners that will tear you to shreads whatever your opinion is!!!
:iagree: The only way you are going to get the info u need..
BabelFish
14-10-2009, 11:33
Awesome another circumcision thread, these never get old.
Do you EVER have anything to add? I mean, anything of worth? If you don't like a thread, don't participate in it.
You'd think that would be easy to work out but ... maybe not.
There's plenty of other sites you can go and troll. Have fun :wave:
I believe in personal choice ie the person who owns the penis should be allowed to make the choice.
The Royal Australian College of Physicians has a pamphlet on circumcision for parents here. (http://www.racp.edu.au/index.cfm?objectid=A4268489-2A57-5487-DEF14F15791C4F22)
After extensive review of the literature, the Paediatrics & Child Health Division of the Royal Australasian College of Physicians has concluded that there is no medical reason for routine newborn male circumcision.
I don't know of any boy who has suffered because his penis looks different to his Dad's but I know of many boys who have suffered because theirs doesn't look like their peers, which will be the case with circ'ed boys who are now in the minority.
It is much safer to have the procedure done as an adult. Babies have died from circumcision, no adult has.
No one has ever died from not being circumcised.
Californication
14-10-2009, 13:21
No way. My son is intact, though DH did want him done so they would look the same. But it's not the "norm" now. As others have said, it's a low percentage that is done now, and even my GP recommended against it! I'm in country WA and my GP there aren't that many doctors who will do it now, as it's not part of the standard training.
I say leave the penis alone. I saw some photos of circs gone wrong and it's not pretty (or functional).
HollyHotLips
14-10-2009, 17:46
Unless there was a medical reason to have it done I would leave it... if your DS wants to have it done when he's older then he can. DH has uncirc and he's never had any health issues. But that's JMHO, obviously the end decision is up to each parent
Personally I prefer an uncirc one :o
I haven't read through this thread but just thought I should say - why on earth would you painfully take away a part of your sons body that can never be returned as a preventative measure for problems which rarely occur???
Furthermore, why would it be cleaner? Aren't you going to teach your son how to wash it properly?
:confused:
serendipity22
23-10-2009, 00:26
Here are some interesting sites:
a New Zealand site
http://www.circumstitions.com/
2 Australian sites
http://www.circinfo.org/
http://www.historyofcircumcision.net/
I recently something recently on the last site. Secular circumcision began in English speaking countries in the late 1800s in an attempt to prevent young boys going insane etc. etc. from masturbating.
When birth was hospitalized in the early 1900s doctors tended to circumcise every boy they could get their hands on. Parental consent was not needed.
In the early 1970s a lawsuit in the US changed all that. Doctors passed the right to circumcise (which they took for granted) to the parents.
This made me look at the view that circumcision is a parent's choice in a different light.
We won't be doing it. No need to as far as we're concerned.
We wouldn't circumcise our daughter, we won't circumcise our son.
I dont understand this comment i mean who in Australia ever circumcises their daughters ...and to be quite honest who can you even compare a male circ to a female circ anyway?
I dont understand this comment i mean who in Australia ever circumcises their daughters ...and to be quite honest who can you even compare a male circ to a female circ anyway?So if we lived in Africa would it be ok to circumcise our daughters? Male circ is just a cultural tradition as old as female circ. It too will take time to phase out, just as with female circ. The two are very much comparable in terms of history and culture. There are a few forms of female circ, the lesser of which is physically a very fair comparison to male circ.
Not at all, i dont agree with females being circ'd at all....and i dont understand how you can compare a female circ to a male circ.
Pippi Longstocking
26-10-2009, 11:58
Not at all, i dont agree with females being circ'd at all....and i dont understand how you can compare a female circ to a male circ.
FGM type I is entirely comparable to male circumcision. Both are unethical, IMO.
i dont understand how you can compare a female circ to a male circ. What is it about the comparison that you don't understand?
Fellow Traveler
26-10-2009, 12:33
Not at all, i dont agree with females being circ'd at all....and i dont understand how you can compare a female circ to a male circ.
Because unnecessary surgery on a non-consenting individual is wrong.
Female circ has never been a done thing here in Austarlia so i dont see why we should be comparing it considering this doesnt even happen in our country.
At the end of the day, just becuase you do or dont agree with it does not mean either party is right...its a personal opinion that we are all entitled to make for ourselves.
Pippi Longstocking
26-10-2009, 15:11
Female circ has never been a done thing here in Austarlia so i dont see why we should be comparing it considering this doesnt even happen in our country.
.
Actually, FGM does happen here, sadly. :( But you're right, girl babies are awarded legal protection over having their genitals altered - I just wish boys had the same right to bodily integrity. It's a shame, I think that altering an infant's genitals, regardless of gender, is entirely inappropriate and unethical.
That being said, I'm not sure why your argument that it doesn't occur here is relevant. Let's try this...imagine we are talking about circumcision in a country where both male and female genital mutilation occurs regularly. When comparing type I FGM with male circumcision, do you find one more abhorrent than the other?
I didnt relaise that girls here in Australia have been circ'd - must be talking many many years ago are we?
Like i said i just think we are all entitled to our own opinions on the subject, wether we agree with circ or not it's really none of anyone elses business i dont think.
sockstealingpoltergeist
26-10-2009, 15:46
,I didnt relaise that girls here in Australia have been circ'd - must be talking many many years ago are we?
Like i said i just think we are all entitled to our own opinions on the subject, wether we agree with circ or not it's really none of anyone elses business i dont think.
No it still occurs just not very often because FGM is illegal.
So type one FGM is very much like male circumcision, so would you object to FGM if it was legal? So why not RIC?
It is other people's business, change does not occur if people all mind their own business. That is how human rights abuse continues.
Obviously you dont understand what i mean when i say its no-one else business...what i mean is it's none of my business if you choose to circ or son or not just as it's none of your business what i choose to do with my son.
Obviously you dont understand what i mean when i say its no-one else business...what i mean is it's none of my business if you choose to circ or son or not just as it's none of your business what i choose to do with my son. I understand what you're saying, it's noone's business if a parent decides to circ their son or daughter, provided it's legal in the country they are doing it. I get you. I do not agree.
sockstealingpoltergeist
26-10-2009, 16:01
Obviously you dont understand what i mean when i say its no-one else business...what i mean is it's none of my business if you choose to circ or son or not just as it's none of your business what i choose to do with my son.
No I understand and I disagree.
It is my business, and that is why I hope RIC is illegal soon. I believe it is a human rights issue, and takes away the individuals right to bodily autonomy.
It shocks me that people would think it is no body elses business, that they want to remove part of their childs penis for no reason. :eek:
Pippi Longstocking
26-10-2009, 16:04
Obviously you dont understand what i mean when i say its no-one else business...what i mean is it's none of my business if you choose to circ or son or not just as it's none of your business what i choose to do with my son.
Do you believe it's anybody else's business if somebody does cir their daughter?
I think anything think anything that harms a child is everybody's business and we all have a responsibility to speak out against such acts. I believe that circumcision violates the rights of the child and is harmful, ergo...
I will continue to speak out against circumcision. Public outrage is how laws get changed. I will never accept that it is "the parent's choice" and I will continue to argue for the rights of all children, male and female, to keep healthy genitals intact for at least as long as it takes for the child to be able to offer true informed consent.
I understand what you're saying, it's noone's business if a parent decides to circ their son or daughter, provided it's legal in the country they are doing it. I get you. I do not agree.
Thankyou! It is currently legal in the country we live in.
Just as a point of historical accuracy, medicalised female circumcision (usually cliterodectomy) was performed regularly in Australia and other Anglophone countries for over 80 years.
It was finally stamped out in British Commonwealth countries around 1930, but continued sporadically in the US until about 1950.
The rationale for it was same as for male circumcision, namely hygiene -- moral and physical, which were actually linked in the prevailing "nervous reflex" theory of the time.
A major argument to abolish it was the assertion that since women didn't masturbate (unless they were mentally unbalanced or deficient), it was an unnecessary procedure.
Pippi Longstocking
26-10-2009, 16:51
A major argument to abolish it was the assertion that since women didn't masturbate (unless they were mentally unbalanced or deficient), it was an unnecessary procedure.
Why, perish the thought! Could you imagine??!!:eek:
:laughing: Olden days people are teh funneh. :yes:
serendipity22
26-10-2009, 22:14
Cliterodectomy was still covered by Blue Cross insurance company till 1977 in the USA.
Up until relatively recently (well i hope they have stopped) baby girls with large clitorises sometimes had them made smaller or even removed by US doctors.
Until 1989 open heart surgery of infants was done without anestethic, because infants didn't feel any pain, according to US doctors.
summamummy
27-10-2009, 08:47
Male circ is a personal choice by the parents of the child full stop!!!! If your not for it then don't do it, simple. As for bringing female circ into the agenda, get real. We are not talking about sadistic procedures for our children, we are making educated decisions that for whatever reasons may offend some of you, it is none of your business. If you don't believe in the procedure then keep your comments to yourself. We don't abuse you for not circumcising your sons, do we?!!
Circumcision is ridiculous IMO.
Male circ is a personal choice by the parents of the child full stop!!!! If your not for it then don't do it, simple. As for bringing female circ into the agenda, get real. We are not talking about sadistic procedures for our children, we are making educated decisions that for whatever reasons may offend some of you, it is none of your business. If you don't believe in the procedure then keep your comments to yourself. We don't abuse you for not circumcising your sons, do we?!!
Calm down.
Circumcision is an abuse of a tiny baby's human rights. Sorry you don't see it that way :( but many people here do and can fight for it to be made illegal if they wish.
Why don't you let your child decide when he is older if he wants it done or not :detective: What about his CHOICE??? I'm sorry he won't get that choice tbh :(
sockstealingpoltergeist
27-10-2009, 08:54
All you anti circ people are ridiculous! Male circ is a personal choice by the parents of the child full stop!!!! If your not for it then don't do it, simple. As for bringing female circ into the agenda, get real. We are not talking about sadistic procedures for our children, we are making educated decisions that for whatever reasons may offend some of you, it is none of your business. If you don't believe in the procedure then keep your comments to yourself. We don't abuse you for not circumcising your sons, do we?!!
No one is personaly abusing anyone. Simply pointing out why RIC is wrong. Did you read the thread?
There is so much info about how dangerous and damaging RIC is.
Type one FGM is very much the same as RIC performed on little boys, yet we don't condone it. Why is that?
I hope it's not available for much longer.:)
There have been a lot of these lately and they always get heated people get hurt and they get closed.
You should do a search in bub hub and read the ones already out there.
totaly agree...these threads just go round and round in circles.
sockstealingpoltergeist
27-10-2009, 08:57
totaly agree...these threads just go round and round in circles.
I havn't found that at all. I have found that quite a lot of useful compelling information against RIC is presented.
I find the people getting hurt are the little baby boys why have RIC preformed on them, and really I don't mind much if someone is offended by the facts and info that proves RIC uneccessary
Pippi Longstocking
27-10-2009, 09:15
Male circ is a personal choice by the parents of the child full stop!!!!
And I'm arguing that it should be the personal choice of the owner of the foreskin full stop
If your not for it then don't do it, simple.
'Cept it isn't really that simple, is it? Let me put it to you like this...if you knew poeple were deliberately hurting their children (with perfectly good intentions), would you speak up? This is just an example, put if parents were holding their children's hands to s hot stove to teach them that it is hot and could burn them, or any other painful and potentially damaging comparison, would you just not do it to your child or would you say "hey! That's wrong!" and try to see the practice stopped?
As for bringing female circ into the agenda, get real.
As I've said quite a few times lately, type I FGM is entirely comparable to male circumcision.
We are not talking about sadistic procedures for our children,
Well clearly that's a matter of opinion....
we are making educated decisions that for whatever reasons may offend some of you, it is none of your business.
If I believe children are being harmed, I make it my business.
We don't abuse you for not circumcising your sons, do we?!![
Well no, that would be silly. Not circumcising a child cannot be described as potentially harmful, nor can it be argued that it is violating a child's basic human right to bodily integrity.
All you anti circ people are ridiculous! Male circ is a personal choice by the parents of the child full stop!!!! If your not for it then don't do it, simple. As for bringing female circ into the agenda, get real. We are not talking about sadistic procedures for our children, we are making educated decisions that for whatever reasons may offend some of you, it is none of your business. If you don't believe in the procedure then keep your comments to yourself. We don't abuse you for not circumcising your sons, do we?!!
I can assure you those people who choose circumcision for their daughters do not consider it to be a sadistic procedure.
They, just like you would be horrified to hear you say circumcising their child is a "sadistic procedure".
They, just like you believe they are doing what is in their daughter's best interest.
They, just like you need more education to stop them making bad decisions.
They, just like you need to leave this decision for the child.
No one is anti-circumcision. Males and females should be able to choose to be circumcised if they wish to be. Nobody should be taking that decision away from any person. Your child is a person. Let them decide what happens to their own genitals. Not much for a person to expect really, is it?
Fuchsia!
27-10-2009, 10:28
Haven't read the whole thread yet but..
I don't agree with RIC at all, I believe a clean penis is a washed penis, doesn't matter if it has foreskin or not.
I think it should be illegal and stopped. Its completely unnecessary.
I believe that its the boys choice whether to get circumcised, not the parents as they aren't the ones that have to live with it.
I would be extremely p!ssed if my parents decdided it was their choice to chop off something that belonged to MY body without my consent.
DoubleDelight
27-10-2009, 11:19
When you look at the prevention argument for circumcision ask yourself this would you cut your daughters breasts off as a baby to lessen the risk of her contracting breast cancer? If the answer is no then why circumcise your son.
I have to agree with summamummy this is ridiculous, i think it has been taken to the absolute extreme. We are all adults with our own views on things and i dont feel anyone should be made to feel any less a person because their opinion differs from yours which is clearly happening here ...anyone who is for circ is copping an earful, anyone would think they were criminals the way you are treating them.
I have to agree with summamummy this is ridiculous, i think it has been taken to the absolute extreme. We are all adults with our own views on things and i dont feel anyone should be made to feel any less a person because their opinion differs from yours which is clearly happening here ...anyone who is for circ is copping an earful, anyone would think they were criminals the way you are treating them.
Don't come in and read it then if you find it offensive. Or report it if you think it is offensive. I don't see anyone being rude and making others feel less of a person. If you are 100% happy with your choice, why let it bother you?
People can be passionate about whatever they like. Circumcision is a serious issue for some people who want to protect tiny babies from harm. Sorry you don't see it that way :(
... anyone would think they were criminals the way you are treating them.
If you surgically altered the genitals of a female infant without medical justification, in any way whatsoever, you would be a criminal.
Double standard ?
..
RedPanda
27-10-2009, 13:04
LeahW, I think if you find something offensive you need to report it. However, you are in the circumcision debate section which is probably one of the most divided sections of BH so I'm not sure what you were expecting.
Perhaps you need a break from BH or you need to stick to other sections.
summamummy
27-10-2009, 13:27
Don't come in and read it then if you find it offensive. Or report it if you think it is offensive. I don't see anyone being rude and making others feel less of a person. If you are 100% happy with your choice, why let it bother you?
People can be passionate about whatever they like. Circumcision is a serious issue for some people who want to protect tiny babies from harm. Sorry you don't see it that way :(
I think that majority of you are being very rude
Circ is best done as a new born, read the facts ladies, the baby doesn't go under any general, the penis is numbed by a numbing cream then the foreskin is clamped and after 2 - 7 days falls off much like the umbilical cord. Every man in mine and my partners family has been circumcised, in fact 95% of males I know have been circumcised. I have asked many men if they are happy they were circumcised as new borns and what do you know, they are! As for waiting till the baby is old enough to make decisions and asking him?! I have never heard of anything so ridiculous, I know in my heart my son will want to be done, like his father, grandfather and so on. In years to come he will thank me. You are making this minor and quite appropiate procedure to be harmful when truthfully it isn't. If your not for it then don't, I'm pretty sure that boys at school don't have their penises on display to eliminate the circumcised ones from the non circ??? My son WILL want to be like his dad, that I know.
Fellow Traveler
27-10-2009, 13:50
I think that majority of you are being very rude.
Circ is best done as a new born, read the facts ladies, the baby doesn't go under any general, the penis is numbed by a numbing cream then the foreskin is clamped and after 2 - 7 days falls off much like the umbilical cord.
What does any of that matter? And I assure you most posters know how a circumcision is performed.
Every man in mine and my partners family has been circumcised, in fact 95% of males I know have been circumcised. I have asked many men if they are happy they were circumcised as new borns and what do you know, they are!
And that's fine for them but there are also men who regret being circumcised. And what about them?
As for waiting till the baby is old enough to make decisions and asking him?! I have never heard of anything so ridiculous,
Why? What's wrong by giving a boy or man the dignity of the choice?
I know in my heart my son will want to be done, like his father, grandfather and so on. In years to come he will thank me.
And what if you're wrong? Why would a boy even care what his father's penis looks like? That seems pretty ridiculous to me.
You are making this minor and quite appropiate procedure to be harmful when truthfully it isn't.
It is harmful. We've only been conditioned to believe it's not.
My son WILL want to be like his dad, that I know.
Why? Why does a boy care what his father's penis looks like? Seems odd.
I will spend my time on whatever cause I find worth it. And to me protecting children, in this case boys, from abuse is worth my efforts.
I know in my heart my son will want to be done, like his father, grandfather and so on................................................ ...
My son WILL want to be like his dad, that I know. How ridiculous. Ask your husband if he even knows let alone cares what his dad's or gandfather's penis looks like. Do you know what your mother's genitals look like? Should we break our baby girl's hymens so they look like us? Absolutely ludicrous.
Circ is best done as a new born, read the facts ladies, the baby doesn't go under any general, the penis is numbed by a numbing cream then the foreskin is clamped and after 2 - 7 days falls off much like the umbilical cord. I never said they go under GA :confused: I'm pretty sure verybody here knows they do that after 6 months normally.
Every man in mine and my partners family has been circumcised, in fact 95% of males I know have been circumcised. I know many men, but never feel the need to ask about their circ status, perhaps you feel a little insecure about your decision if you need to ask every man you know. Also, your son when he grows up will be in the minority approx only 15% of males in Australia are done these days.
I have asked many men if they are happy they were circumcised as new borns and what do you know, they are! Again, why ask? To validate your decision to circ your son? Do you think any man who has his penis altered without permission is going to say how unhappy they are to you, apart from maybe your DH. Not conversation I have with the males that I know.
As for waiting till the baby is old enough to make decisions and asking him?! I have never heard of anything so ridiculous, I know in my heart my son will want to be done, like his father, grandfather and so on. In years to come he will thank me. You can't predict that your son will be thankful. My 2 brothers are done, but their 3 boys are not, they didn't see it necessary. They didn't care that their sons look like daddy. Have you ever seen 2 penises that are identical? Your child will be more worried about what his friends penises look like in the shower after the footy or cricket than what his dad's or his grandfather's is. There was a thread on here about a woman whose 13 year old son wishes she hadn't circumcised him. I bet she thought he would be thankful too. And another member on here who resents his parents for circumcising him.
You are making this minor and quite appropiate procedure to be harmful when truthfully it isn't. If your not for it then don't, I'm pretty sure that boys at school don't have their penises on display to eliminate the circumcised ones from the non circ??? My son WILL want to be like his dad, that I know.
If you believe it is so minor, why are midwives and doctors rude to you about it when you ask questions and why is it so hard to get information about getting it done. :detective: I mean, isn't that why you found out the sex of your baby, to prepare in advance for his circumcision and try and find a doctor etc.
It is a very worthy cause in my mind and thankfully, I can try and educate people to not. Also, you don't know what else I do with my life and what otehr human rights issues I fight for...perhaps if this is making you so angry and hurt, you should not enter into this discussion.
sockstealingpoltergeist
27-10-2009, 14:10
Circ is best done as a new born, read the facts ladies, the baby doesn't go under any general, the penis is numbed by a numbing cream then the foreskin is clamped and after 2 - 7 days falls off much like the umbilical cord. !!!!
Problem is unlike the umbilical cord (which does not hurt) it isn't meant to drop off. There have been plenty of studies done to show that babies feel pain while having it done and often go into shock. Many babies also die from complications resulting from circ. So tragic for an unecessary elctive cosmetic surgery.
I wouldn't want genital surgery done with just some numbing cream:eek:
Every man in mine and my partners family has been circumcised, in fact 95% of males I know have been circumcised. I have asked many men if they are happy they were circumcised as new borns and what do you know, they are! !!!!
All my family members (bar the youngest boys) are circumcised. Most men would never admit their penis could have been better, it is embaressing for them.
My DH who is circ'd believes that circing is unessecary. Ask non circ'd men and boys if they wish they were done and the majority would say NO I am sure. Plus they at least have the option left open to them.
As for waiting till the baby is old enough to make decisions and asking him?! I have never heard of anything so ridiculous, I know in my heart my son will want to be done, like his father, grandfather and so on. In years to come he will thank me. !!!!
Why is bodily autonomy and choice ridiculous?:confused:
You don't know that, and he will also be in the minority.
if it's so great I'm sure he will choose it for himself when he turns 18.
You are making this minor and quite appropiate procedure to be harmful when truthfully it isn't. If your not for it then don't, I'm pretty sure that boys at school don't have their penises on display to eliminate the circumcised ones from the non circ??? !!!!
Truthfully it really is. Any procedure on infants is very risky. Many infants are harmed and maimed by this unecceassry procedure.:(
Well boys compare them selves to their peers appearance more so then daddy.
My son WILL want to be like his dad, that I know
Why will he want to be more like dad. Most young men want to fit in with their friends, not only that, your son won't be exactly the same as your DH in any other way, why does it matter if their penis matches?:confused:
Are you also going to glue chest hair on him and have him grow facial hair? It's fairly easy to explain differences.
Foreskins can't be put back.
Pippi Longstocking
27-10-2009, 14:19
I think that majority of you are being very rude!
I'm sorry you found my comment rude and offensive, I hope you saw my disclaimer! :shakehands: I should have clarified further - the "your face is!" line is thrown around frequently in my house by my teenage child in response to any comment we may make. Here, in our home, it is amusing and not at all offensive, but I fully concede that it is an in-joke and you weren't to know that.
ETA: I've deleted the offending comment, I hope we can now get back to debating the issue rather than name-calling etc. :-)
summamummy
27-10-2009, 14:38
I don't care about any other man that has regretted a circumcision?!!! All I care about is my family. And yes it is very important to us that our son is like dad, I have all the support of my family and friends, doctors and so on. Anyway I'm not here to fight with people and cause negativity, I have nothing to PROVE to anyone, so good luck with your decisions and I hope you are all comfortable with what you decide. I certainly am and my decision has been decided by research,education and discussion. I feel for those of you that can't see past your ignorance and accept that your way isn't the only way.
Each to their own everyone:flowerz::flowerz::flowerz::flowerz:
My comment came from asking my husband those questions, and yes we both feel very strongly that we want him to look like dad. Yes I have seen my own mother naked, meaning her vagina haven't you?? I think breaking our daughters Hymens is taking things a bit far, very strange you felt the need to say that????? :confused: No stranger than putting your son through risky, painful surgery so that he can look like his dad. The only reason you think that it is ok, is due to your cultural conditioning. For most of Europe the idea of circumcising your son would be considered very strange indeed.
I am not the least concerned with how my genitals look compared to my mothers, just as no one else I have ever spoken to cares about how theirs looks in comparison to either of their parents.
Pippi Longstocking
27-10-2009, 15:01
I believe circumcision is harmful. I believe parents do not have the right to remove any healthy parts of the child. I believe that parents that do choose to alter their child's genitals do so with good intention, but that they are misinformed/blinded by cultural conditioning and perpetuating a culture of human rights abuses.
A lot of off topic and rude posts have been deleted.
Please note that this thread is in the "Discuss-It" section of the forum. It is neither a pro or anti area of the circumcision section and therefore, deserves responses from both sides of the argument that are not rude, aggressive or dripping with sarcasm.
We all have differing opinions on this subject, but surely we are able to discuss them with a little maturity and mutual respect for others.
I will re-open this thread, but any further slanging matches will be deleted and the thread will be permanently closed.
Cheers
:)
summamummy
27-10-2009, 15:11
:confused: No stranger than putting your son through risky, painful surgery so that he can look like his dad. The only reason you think that it is ok, is due to your cultural conditioning. For most of Europe the idea of circumcising your son would be considered very strange indeed.
I am not the least concerned with how my genitals look compared to my mothers, just as no one else I have ever spoken to cares about how theirs looks in comparison to either of their parents.
The procedure is not risky and doesn't involve the pain that you are all going on about. Hence why I am for this procedure, I would never put my son through as you say 'a risky procedure'. My sons health and well being is most important to me, another reason why I am for this. I don't think you ladies have researched this enough to state your opinions??? Your views about circumcision and the procedure are warped.
Why don't you stop attacking the people for this procedure and accept the reality.
Fuchsia!
27-10-2009, 15:26
Each to their own everyone:flowerz::flowerz::flowerz::flowerz:
Yes, each to their own genitals.
I don't think you ladies have researched this enough to state your opinions??? Your views about circumcision and the procedure are warped.
Do you know how many babies have died from circumcisions?
Do you know the details of latest death?
Do you know the circumcision complication rate?
Do you know the most common complications arising from infant circumcision?
I know the answers to all of those questions, which is why I say it is risky.
Clearly you have not researched this enough because you don't think there are any risks. Scary indeed.
Circ is best done as a new born, read the facts ladies, the baby doesn't go under any general, the penis is numbed by a numbing cream then the foreskin is clamped and after 2 - 7 days falls off much like the umbilical cord. Every man in mine and my partners family has been circumcised, in fact 95% of males I know have been circumcised. I have asked many men if they are happy they were circumcised as new borns and what do you know, they are! As for waiting till the baby is old enough to make decisions and asking him?! I have never heard of anything so ridiculous, I know in my heart my son will want to be done, like his father, grandfather and so on. In years to come he will thank me. You are making this minor and quite appropiate procedure to be ******** when truthfully it isn't. If your not for it then don't, I'm pretty sure that boys at school don't have their penises on display to eliminate the circumcised ones from the non circ??? My son WILL want to be like his dad, that I know. Your ignorance offends me and it's small minded people like yourselves that makes the world such a ****ed up place to live. Spend your time fighting for a more worthy cause, honestly get a life!!!!
Great post summamummy. I couldn't agree more.
It's great to hear from another parent who has the confidence in their own abilities to make a decision for their family.
I too know that my boy will be glad he was circumcised. He will be raised with enough respect towards his mother and father that he will understand that we made the decision in his best interest. And, he will respect our decision because he respects us.
I I have felt like I need to defend my opinion and rights, which is ridiculous. As I mentioned earlier the people for the procedure don't get heated and rude to the mothers not circumcising their sons.
What about the rights of your son?
Isn't there a reason why it is not performed in hospitals anymore? Why is it so hard to get midwives to talk about it? Why do people need to search for a doctor? Why do some people find out baby's sex so they can organise a circumcision?
This thread will now REMAIN closed.
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