How do YOU define a tantrum?

[UmmInayah]

I have been reading a bit about tantrums lately, and it has become apparent to me that some people think of tantrums differently to others.

For me, a tantrum isn't when bub is trying to assert herself, or when she is upset about there not being any apples in the fridge..

I have never witnessed my bub just throw herself on the floor for no reason (which is what I would consider a tantrum.. getting upset for no reason). There is always something that she is upset/angry/frustrated about.. Even though it might take her a while to actually tell me what it is. Or I might know what it is (like her wanting the blue cup instead of the red cup) and I don't understand why she wants it, but I know that's why she is upset.

Which is why I find it really hard to wonder how parents can just put their children aside and let them "cry out" what they perceive is a tantrum.. Surely there is a reason behind the cry? And why is it okay for us as adults to get upset/angry/frustrated and express it and want someone to listen, but with children we feel the need to distract or ignore?

JMO..

How do you define a tantrum and how do you deal with it?

[~Temet Nosce~]

Yes, I agree with you, there is always a reason for it, usually with my dd it's her frusteration at not being able to get/do something etc.

Why do I leave her to cry sometimes?

Because there is nothing else I can do. You need to understand that what may work for your child, does not always work for another. I let her vent her frustration, calm down, then she comes to me and we have a cuddle. And all is well again.

If I can fix it, I do. But I can't always fix it. And to avoid being hit in the stomach yet again I will let her kick and scream it out on her own.

How do you suggest I fix a tantrum that she is having about say.. not being able to have that lolly? Do I just give it to her and let her think that screaming about something will let her get her own way? No way..
I explain to her that no she can't have it, and why she can't have it, and then let her get her frustration over not being able to have it, out.

[Boobycino]

For me a tamtrum is when bubba is angry or upset AT me or AT a situation. Like he's playing with the remote control and I take it off him and he falls apart screaming, but he's glaring right at me - so I know he's saying in bubba language "Mumma, GIVE IT BACK! I want it!!!!"

That to me is a temper tantrum.

I dont think a tantrum is a bad thing. I dont think it says anything bad about him. I dont think is says anything bad about me as a parent.

Theres not a whole lot I can do if he's having a tantrum is the other thing that defines something to me as a tantrum. If he's just aserting he wants the remote control back he'll shout at me for a moment, but I offer him another toy and he's pleased and can move on. If he's a bit tired, or itrs the umpteenth time I've taken the remote control or something similar off him, then he can just go for longer and no amount of cheering up, cuddles, offer of toys, offer of boob, will calm him down. He's gonna go through the process of letting out that frustration, so I stand by until he's ready for a cuddle or a new toy.

Its usually a sign to me that either bed time or a meal time is approaching and he's just running out of steam.

I dont have a problem with the fact my son gets angry or frustrated or whatever. He's allowed to have his own emotions and express them. I just dont enter into it, he doesn't gain anything from me by chucking a tanty. But I'm sure he feels a bit better afterwards. :yes:

Also wanna add that when bubba has a tantrum he's not crying. He's shouting or screaming. If he's crying "waa waa" crying, then I cuddle him, kiss him, feed him, find out whats really wrong. But theres no point trying if he's just gonna hit me or push me away. I'd love it if all he needed was some comfort, but when he's tantrumming, he doesn't want me.

I suppose also its different temperaments with children. Some bubs just dont get angry about things. Some bubs have much more even natures, or are more sensitive so will cry and want a cuddle and comfort, my son gets cross. He's been able to get cross since he was a newborn baby. You'd have to see it to believe it, but I know he would get angry with me if I took too long to get my boob out. He had no issues attaching, it was me who would struggle a bit and if I took too long he would truely glare at me and screaming.

Oh he's a joy sometimes. On the other hand he's very very sweet and very very charming :D and very very cuddly when he wants to be, but he's usually the first to push away from a cuddle and go off and do his own thing.

I wouldn't mind a clingy baby some days, might make me feel a bit more important!

[MrsTiggyWinkle]

A tantrum for us is whan dd1 acts up to get her own way, when she has been told she can't have something. We usually have a good reason for saying no to her, like when she wants to take out another toy but its bedtime.

If she has a 'tanty' we mostly ignore her and just say 'Mummy said no'! She's old enough to understand what no means, but that is how we have dealt with it from very early on. Not sure if it will continue to be this easy as she goes through the Terrible Twos tho!

IMHO some kids can be really stubborn and insist on getting their own way, I can understand parents ignoring them if its the 15th time they have had to deal with a tantrum today! But I also think that for some kids its a way of looking for attention (any reaction is better than no reaction) or because of mixed messages (if I keep it up I will get my way).

Plus kids are such little things and emotions are big things to deal with, I read somewhere about toddlers having 'excess joy and excess sadness', I guess the same thing applies to frustration.

Your bub is a lucky one that you take the time to understand her language!

[NonnyMouse]

To me a tantrum is a fit of temper far larger than the situation that caused it. A child throwing a tantrum is no longer capable of calming themselves down, they can't be reasoned with, and they are beyond being able to stop it by themselves.

In most situations, I believe tantrums need to be made safe, and then allowed to run their course. Safe means preventing harm to the child and other people and property, and for some kids this means firmly holding them until it's passed, for others it means being by themselves (because for some kids the proximity of another person will make it worse and they are more able to calm down if they don't have an audience).

Toddlers don't have the emotional maturity to control their outbursts. After a tantrum has passed is the time for reflection on what could have been done differently, and talking it through with them if they're old enough.

Minimising tantrums is a balancing act between letting them explore and discover their environment, and removing from it the things likely to set them off repeatedly (i.e. if they can't touch the blue vase, and it's nice and enticing and within reach, then you need to remove the blue vase or put it out of reach until such time as they are old enough to understand and comply when you say no).

[Areca]

I don't think any child would throw themselves on the floor and have a tantrum for no reason what so ever.

For me a tantrum is a name for a certain behaviour. The behaviour where they have lost the plot basically and their emotions have overtaken their body.

I deal with them differently for each child because they both respond differently.

My two year old's tantrums will only last a couple of minutes so I just ride it out. She is always offered a cuddle but often says no in the beginning. At the end I always cuddle her. I may leave her to tantrum on her own, or I might stay with her...depends on what's happening as to what I do in regards to that. I can't always 'drop everything' to sit with her when she's having several a day (because it's how she currently knows to get her point across).
If it goes on for more than a couple of minutes then I use distraction techniques because it helps for her to get control over her emotions. I'd rather distract her with a toy, or looking for an imaginery dog etc. so she calms down in a couple of minutes, than have her be so upset for 10-15 minutes.
Really...it's just like an adult in that sense. I know if I'm upset DH will come and console me when I'm ready to be consoled and then will do his best to cheer me up by changing the subject. I do the same for him, or if it's a friend etc. If I'm alone and feeling down in the sumps I'll do my best to distract myself and get in a better mood.


DD1 gets treated a bit differently. She is almost 4 and most of the time she is rational...if she's upset she'll talk to us rather than throw herself down on the ground. However, when she's tired she throws a tantrum. She gets offered a cuddle...generally she responds by trying to hit or kick us if we even approach her. so she is put in her room for everyone's safety. It's not even about just giving her the space where she is because if we go about our faily life around her she moves herself towards one of us to lash out, or she picks up objects and throws them in our direction (last time she took her shoes off and pegged them at me and DD2). she chucked a tantrum the other night...purely tiredness related. she wanted to lie her legs on me which was fine...but then she started kicking me in the side. I'm 34 weeks pregnant. So she was warned to stop it or she'd go to her room so we could all be safe. she stopped the kicking...when it came to pegging the shoes she was told to stop after one shoe, she then pegged the other shoe. She was upset because I had helped her close the car door and she wanted to do it by herself that time. Her tantrums can go anywhere from 45 minutes to 2 hours. I don't have 2 hours to sit with her and dodge missiles, avoid being beaten on etc. Just like if it was an adult trying to beat me up...I wouldn't sit and take it. I'd protect myself.

Every few minutes I go in to DD1 and ask her if she wants a cuddle. I know she's ready for one when she doesn't lash out at me for opening the door but I often just sit next to her and let her come to me because if I try and cuddle her too early then it makes matetrs worse.

I wish I could distract DD1. I don't actually like watching my child get in to that state and staying in that state for such a long amonut of time. It's heartbreaking, and when it's regular it gets downright frustrating and very hard to remain patient. I'm only human after all.

After DD1 has a tantrum we cuddle and talk about why she got upset and what would have been a better way to deal with it. We talk about how it's not nice to hit/kick/throw things at people etc. Sometimes she'll be with it enough to give her choices - eg. if you want to keep crying then you can, but we're about to do this so if you want to come join us stop crying and come join us. It works sometimes and again, it's just about teaching her to calm down. If she clearly wants to join us in whatever we're doing I'll happily stay and help her calm down...encouraging her to take deep braths, getting her a drink etc.


Sometimes she's so far gone we need to just dim the lights, put on some soothing music her and wait for her to come out of it herself.

My kids are absolutely allowed to get angry/frustrated/upset and have someone listen to them but I also feel it's my job to teach them how to control their emotions and get their point across in a more productive way. I don't want my teenage daughter bashing me up every time she gets upset with me...she'll be way too big to carry in to her room at that age.


I did find it upsetting today though. I went to Target to buy some new underwear and there was a baby who would've been no older than 12 months and she was really upset about something. she was with her mother and grandmother. The grandmother was holding her and the mother was pointing to her DD and yelling 'naughty, naughty, you're naughty (baby name)' Then she'd leave it a minute and turn around and yell out the same thing. I just wanted to go and give the baby a hug.


ETA - DD1 is an asthmatic and the ventolin makes her angry and we deal with a lot more tantrums then. We do our best to protect ourselves and not leave her when she's having a medicine induced tantrum because they must be really scary for her when she doesn't have the control over them.

[sahm]

There is always something that she is upset/angry/frustrated about.. Even though it might take her a while to actually tell me what it is. Or I might know what it is (like her wanting the blue cup instead of the red cup) and I don't understand why she wants it, but I know that's why she is upset.

Which is why I find it really hard to wonder how parents can just put their children aside and let them "cry out" what they perceive is a tantrum.. Surely there is a reason behind the cry? And why is it okay for us as adults to get upset/angry/frustrated and express it and want someone to listen, but with children we feel the need to distract or ignore?


I agree that there's usually a reason behind this kind of behaviour but to me, it's about teaching them the appropriate reactions and how to manage their feelings in proportion to the situation.

To borrow the example you used, if he throws himself on the floor because I put water in the blue cup instead of the red cup, I'll tell him that I've poured the water now and he can have the red cup next time. If he continues to scream and yell about it, I'll explain it one more time, if he continues, then I put the cup on his table and I tell him that I'm going to .... insert household activity here and he can come and join me when he's settled down.

It's not that their feelings are unreasonable or need to be ignored it's that it's important to teach them some self-control in how they express there emotions.

[Lillynix]

To me a tantrum is a fit of temper far larger than the situation that caused it. A child throwing a tantrum is no longer capable of calming themselves down, they can't be reasoned with, and they are beyond being able to stop it by themselves.

In most situations, I believe tantrums need to be made safe, and then allowed to run their course. Safe means preventing harm to the child and other people and property, and for some kids this means firmly holding them until it's passed, for others it means being by themselves (because for some kids the proximity of another person will make it worse and they are more able to calm down if they don't have an audience).

Toddlers don't have the emotional maturity to control their outbursts. After a tantrum has passed is the time for reflection on what could have been done differently, and talking it through with them if they're old enough.

Minimising tantrums is a balancing act between letting them explore and discover their environment, and removing from it the things likely to set them off repeatedly (i.e. if they can't touch the blue vase, and it's nice and enticing and within reach, then you need to remove the blue vase or put it out of reach until such time as they are old enough to understand and comply when you say no).

Yeah, that!! I totally agree.

My DD is now 3yo and has just started these kind of 'tantrums', it gets to the point where she becomes a screeching ball of pure rage which is a mass over reaction for what little thing made her feel like that.

It can be something as small as her asking for another biscuit and me saying that she's already had 2 and it's nearly dinner time so she should wait and then all of a sudden she goes bright red in the face, yells and screeches at the top of her voice to the point of sound hoarse, she throws things, kicks things, hits things (and us) and it's just utterly frightening to watch. But this is just her learning how to deal with her emotions and we are trying to help her find ways to cope with them rather than letting it all explode like that.

[crazymuma]

I have been reading a bit about tantrums lately, and it has become apparent to me that some people think of tantrums differently to others.

For me, a tantrum isn't when bub is trying to assert herself, or when she is upset about there not being any apples in the fridge..

I have never witnessed my bub just throw herself on the floor for no reason (which is what I would consider a tantrum.. getting upset for no reason). There is always something that she is upset/angry/frustrated about.. Even though it might take her a while to actually tell me what it is. Or I might know what it is (like her wanting the blue cup instead of the red cup) and I don't understand why she wants it, but I know that's why she is upset.

Which is why I find it really hard to wonder how parents can just put their children aside and let them "cry out" what they perceive is a tantrum.. Surely there is a reason behind the cry? And why is it okay for us as adults to get upset/angry/frustrated and express it and want someone to listen, but with children we feel the need to distract or ignore?

JMO..

How do you define a tantrum and how do you deal with it?


Sweet and simple - if I told my daughter there weren't any apples in the fridge and she threw herself down screaming then to me thats a tantrum. I would repeat that their aren't any more apples and possible offer a orange - if the screaming continued then time out for sure.
Guess what lifes hard and kids need to learn from a young age that they can't always get what they want - if they learn that a screaming fit will get it for them what makes you think they won't be doing that in 3 or 4 years.
I just make sure that after time out I explain to them that that behaviour won't be accepted - I try and give them other ideas on how they could have handled the situation better - its not like I just throw them in time out and walk away then let them up after 5 minutes without explanation.

Sorry but I don't agree with the style of parenting that ignores the childs screaming all the time offering different things until you find what they want - I have watched my cousin do this with her kids - she would give them the blue cup after they screamed over the red one - and guess what her kids are all over 10 now and still throwing tantrums thinking the world revolves around them - quite amazing to watch a 10 year old throw themself down until mum gets it right.

[SassyMummy]

I think a tantrum is when the child acts almost as if possessed... over something fairly miniscule.

DD is 4 and she'll throw whoppers about what is seemingly nothing. Sure, there's a reason, but her reaction is much larger than the problem itself. You can tell the difference because normally she'll just sulk and whinge about said problem... but it's a tantrum when she loses it, throws herself on the ground and cannot be comforted.

She got angry at me because there was dew on the grass the other day. Normally she'll complain about it because she's very particular and doesn't like to get dirty or wet or anything... but she fully lost it. She was rolling all over the grass (so rolling herseld in dew...lol), screaming at me, shrieking like a banshee, and nothing I could do would settle her down.

So I went back inside.

Watching her like that just frustrates me and stresses me out, and there's nothing I can do to console her so she can just get over it in her own time and then she'll forget about it and be fine.

It's more likely to happen if she's tired, naturally.

At this age, she's more than capable of expressing what needs/wants, so it's not just that toddler frustration in her case... she just turns into a screaming nutbag.

Time alone to settle down seems to be the best remedy. She's not rational, and she's more likely to rake my eyes out and cuddle me and settle down... so I don't bother with that either.

[Lilyloo]

Sweet and simple - if I told my daughter there weren't any apples in the fridge and she threw herself down screaming then to me thats a tantrum. I would repeat that their aren't any more apples and possible offer a orange - if the screaming continued then time out for sure.
Guess what lifes hard and kids need to learn from a young age that they can't always get what they want - if they learn that a screaming fit will get it for them what makes you think they won't be doing that in 3 or 4 years.
I just make sure that after time out I explain to them that that behaviour won't be accepted - I try and give them other ideas on how they could have handled the situation better - its not like I just throw them in time out and walk away then let them up after 5 minutes without explanation.

Sorry but I don't agree with the style of parenting that ignores the childs screaming all the time offering different things until you find what they want - I have watched my cousin do this with her kids - she would give them the blue cup after they screamed over the red one - and guess what her kids are all over 10 now and still throwing tantrums thinking the world revolves around them - quite amazing to watch a 10 year old throw themself down until mum gets it right.

I have to agree with with... My DD will also scream over what colour cup she has, but there is no way I'll be there offering every colour until she has what she wants.

I agree that they need to learn they can't always have what they want.

If you want/ask a cup of water, of course I will give you that. But if you throw yourself on ther floor and have a tantrum because you don't like the cup it's in...??? Not on!

[BabelFish]

To me a tantrum is a fit of temper far larger than the situation that caused it. A child throwing a tantrum is no longer capable of calming themselves down, they can't be reasoned with, and they are beyond being able to stop it by themselves.

In most situations, I believe tantrums need to be made safe, and then allowed to run their course. Safe means preventing harm to the child and other people and property, and for some kids this means firmly holding them until it's passed, for others it means being by themselves (because for some kids the proximity of another person will make it worse and they are more able to calm down if they don't have an audience).

Toddlers don't have the emotional maturity to control their outbursts. After a tantrum has passed is the time for reflection on what could have been done differently, and talking it through with them if they're old enough.

Minimising tantrums is a balancing act between letting them explore and discover their environment, and removing from it the things likely to set them off repeatedly (i.e. if they can't touch the blue vase, and it's nice and enticing and within reach, then you need to remove the blue vase or put it out of reach until such time as they are old enough to understand and comply when you say no).
That pretty much sums it up for me.

Children aren't delicate little dolls who must be tiptoed around. Like adults, they have emotions and need to be able to express them. As children, they aren't so good at expressing them, so we need to help them out a bit.

Some people ignore tantrums, some people indulge them. I would try to meet somewhere in the middle.

How you handle it also depends very much on the age of the child, their history, their daily behaviour and how they handle frustration and impulse control generally. Every child is different, just as every adult is. There is no ONE way to handle their behaviour, you just have to pay attention to them and try to understand what makes them tick.

[Boobycino]

That pretty much sums it up for me.

Children aren't delicate little dolls who must be tiptoed around. Like adults, they have emotions and need to be able to express them. As children, they aren't so good at expressing them, so we need to help them out a bit.

Some people ignore tantrums, some people indulge them. I would try to meet somewhere in the middle.

How you handle it also depends very much on the age of the child, their history, their daily behaviour and how they handle frustration and impulse control generally. Every child is different, just as every adult is. There is no ONE way to handle their behaviour, you just have to pay attention to them and try to understand what makes them tick.

:iagree:

[reAllytee]

I don't think any child would throw themselves on the floor and have a tantrum for no reason what so ever.

For me a tantrum is a name for a certain behaviour. The behaviour where they have lost the plot basically and their emotions have overtaken their body.

I deal with them differently for each child because they both respond differently.

My two year old's tantrums will only last a couple of minutes so I just ride it out. She is always offered a cuddle but often says no in the beginning. At the end I always cuddle her. I may leave her to tantrum on her own, or I might stay with her...depends on what's happening as to what I do in regards to that. I can't always 'drop everything' to sit with her when she's having several a day (because it's how she currently knows to get her point across).
If it goes on for more than a couple of minutes then I use distraction techniques because it helps for her to get control over her emotions. I'd rather distract her with a toy, or looking for an imaginery dog etc. so she calms down in a couple of minutes, than have her be so upset for 10-15 minutes.
Really...it's just like an adult in that sense. I know if I'm upset DH will come and console me when I'm ready to be consoled and then will do his best to cheer me up by changing the subject. I do the same for him, or if it's a friend etc. If I'm alone and feeling down in the sumps I'll do my best to distract myself and get in a better mood.


DD1 gets treated a bit differently. She is almost 4 and most of the time she is rational...if she's upset she'll talk to us rather than throw herself down on the ground. However, when she's tired she throws a tantrum. She gets offered a cuddle...generally she responds by trying to hit or kick us if we even approach her. so she is put in her room for everyone's safety. It's not even about just giving her the space where she is because if we go about our faily life around her she moves herself towards one of us to lash out, or she picks up objects and throws them in our direction (last time she took her shoes off and pegged them at me and DD2). she chucked a tantrum the other night...purely tiredness related. she wanted to lie her legs on me which was fine...but then she started kicking me in the side. I'm 34 weeks pregnant. So she was warned to stop it or she'd go to her room so we could all be safe. she stopped the kicking...when it came to pegging the shoes she was told to stop after one shoe, she then pegged the other shoe. She was upset because I had helped her close the car door and she wanted to do it by herself that time. Her tantrums can go anywhere from 45 minutes to 2 hours. I don't have 2 hours to sit with her and dodge missiles, avoid being beaten on etc. Just like if it was an adult trying to beat me up...I wouldn't sit and take it. I'd protect myself.

Every few minutes I go in to DD1 and ask her if she wants a cuddle. I know she's ready for one when she doesn't lash out at me for opening the door but I often just sit next to her and let her come to me because if I try and cuddle her too early then it makes matetrs worse.

I wish I could distract DD1. I don't actually like watching my child get in to that state and staying in that state for such a long amonut of time. It's heartbreaking, and when it's regular it gets downright frustrating and very hard to remain patient. I'm only human after all.

After DD1 has a tantrum we cuddle and talk about why she got upset and what would have been a better way to deal with it. We talk about how it's not nice to hit/kick/throw things at people etc. Sometimes she'll be with it enough to give her choices - eg. if you want to keep crying then you can, but we're about to do this so if you want to come join us stop crying and come join us. It works sometimes and again, it's just about teaching her to calm down. If she clearly wants to join us in whatever we're doing I'll happily stay and help her calm down...encouraging her to take deep braths, getting her a drink etc.


Sometimes she's so far gone we need to just dim the lights, put on some soothing music her and wait for her to come out of it herself.

My kids are absolutely allowed to get angry/frustrated/upset and have someone listen to them but I also feel it's my job to teach them how to control their emotions and get their point across in a more productive way. I don't want my teenage daughter bashing me up every time she gets upset with me...she'll be way too big to carry in to her room at that age.


I did find it upsetting today though. I went to Target to buy some new underwear and there was a baby who would've been no older than 12 months and she was really upset about something. she was with her mother and grandmother. The grandmother was holding her and the mother was pointing to her DD and yelling 'naughty, naughty, you're naughty (baby name)' Then she'd leave it a minute and turn around and yell out the same thing. I just wanted to go and give the baby a hug.


ETA - DD1 is an asthmatic and the ventolin makes her angry and we deal with a lot more tantrums then. We do our best to protect ourselves and not leave her when she's having a medicine induced tantrum because they must be really scary for her when she doesn't have the control over them.

Sheesh talk about describing our household !!!

Tantrums with G area easily dealt with he hasnt got many words but he doesnt really even tantrum as he is so easy going most of the time !

Boof ....

Oh deary me, this boy could tantrums for hours & no it isnt over 'nothing' but at 4yrs its often over very petty things because he is tired or the likes.

If I didnt walk away or put him in time out then I would get hit, kicked or things pegged/ thrown at me. As it is he has a vicious tongue & the verbal abuse some days makes me feel quite devastated tbh because I loathe hearing him say he doesnt love me or doesnt want to live with me anymore etc.

He is going through a lot atm & I totally get where its coming from but at the same time I cant act like its acceptable behaviour when it simpy isnt. He knows he is allowed to feel those emotions etc but that acting out isnt good enough.

[UmmInayah]

How do we then teach our children HOW to display "acceptable behaviour"??

With my DD, I try to sit with her whenever she is upset about something. Most of the time she doesn't want me there and will tell me to go, but I usually stay within a distance where she can still see me and try to keep my eye on her while she cries. Eventually she stops crying and tells me she wants a hug and a kiss or she wants me to carry her, which is fine.

But how do we teach our children that it is not okay to hit etc, but it IS okay to feel upset angry etc and that you're there for them EVEN when they are feeling negative emotions without putting them in a timeout type area and ignoring them?

ETA this isn't a rhetorical question.. I am really looking for answers here..

[UmmInayah]

Sweet and simple - if I told my daughter there weren't any apples in the fridge and she threw herself down screaming then to me thats a tantrum. I would repeat that their aren't any more apples and possible offer a orange - if the screaming continued then time out for sure.
Guess what lifes hard and kids need to learn from a young age that they can't always get what they want - if they learn that a screaming fit will get it for them what makes you think they won't be doing that in 3 or 4 years.
I just make sure that after time out I explain to them that that behaviour won't be accepted - I try and give them other ideas on how they could have handled the situation better - its not like I just throw them in time out and walk away then let them up after 5 minutes without explanation.

Sorry but I don't agree with the style of parenting that ignores the childs screaming all the time offering different things until you find what they want - I have watched my cousin do this with her kids - she would give them the blue cup after they screamed over the red one - and guess what her kids are all over 10 now and still throwing tantrums thinking the world revolves around them - quite amazing to watch a 10 year old throw themself down until mum gets it right.

I certainly don't agree with giving my child everything. Children benefit from understanding and learning boundaries.

You have missed my point completely.

[reAllytee]

Well it comes down to teaching about love for us just as much as any emotion ....

We have a great set of books called ' When I'm Feeling ... ' these come in Angry, Jealous, Happy, Sad, Lonely, Loved, Kind & Scared ...

They are FANTASTIC & have helped so much with Boof because it has taught him that its fine & more than ok to be feeling angry or whatever but its just not acceptable to hurt others because we feel that way. It talks about taking themselves to their 'quiet place' & Boof now will often do this when he gets angry ( he goes & sits behind our dining table cause he can be alone there lol ) or to talk it out etc.

Obviously its harder with younger kids which is often why distraction & all those types of methods are used say under 2-3yrs depending on the child but really after 3yrs getting kids to use their words & start helping them towards explaining & understanding their feelings is the key IMO. They arent going to truly 'get it' but its the foundation for as they grow.

[~Temet Nosce~]

Well it comes down to teaching about love for us just as much as any emotion ....

We have a great set of books called ' When I'm Feeling ... ' these come in Angry, Jealous, Happy, Sad, Lonely, Loved, Kind & Scared ...

They are FANTASTIC & have helped so much with Boof because it has taught him that its fine & more than ok to be feeling angry or whatever but its just not acceptable to hurt others because we feel that way. It talks about taking themselves to their 'quiet place' & Boof now will often do this when he gets angry ( he goes & sits behind our dining table cause he can be alone there lol ) or to talk it out etc.

dd has some of those books :thumbsup:, only angry and sad at the moment but I'm working on getting the rest.. she loves the bunny and always hugs the sad book because he is sad :laughing:

[BabelFish]

To be honest, OP, I agree with you on the way you approach the tantrum - i.e. sitting with your child. I actually had discussed this with DP before we ever had kids and I always said that something I regret from my childhood was that I felt that as the youngest with a very outspoken family I was rarely `heard' - as in validated. It's something I still struggle with now. So I never want a child of mine to feel as though their emotions aren't worth me being there for them - even if they're irrational, over the top or tantrums. Little kids have tantrums, they can't help it. Ignoring them or being unavailable is not something that appeals to me.

Having said that, indulging doesn't appeal either so what to do? I think your approach is the right one. Be available and present, but don't pander. Let your child know that whilst you don't approve of their behaviour at that time, that you still love and approve of them. I even used to imagine that if my child ever had a tantrum in a public place, that I would shut out everyone else around me and just sit there until it was over. I still plan to do that, although it will be hard.

As for the other aspects of learning that you ask about, well, I think that just comes with age and understanding, and consistent, repetitive direction from you and other caregivers. When children are learning to control themselves and understand their emotions, leading by example I think is the absolute best way to teach them. And if you are unfailingly consistent in your management, they will always know what to expect and learn from that, too. You need to be flexible and adaptable, but as consistent as possible.

Whoever said parenting was going to be easy, huh? :D

[iamLilysmummy]

thats so true.

if u say it like that,

my DD has never had a tantrum..

she never throws herself to the floor or anything like that..

she just crys coz shes frustrated and hasnt yet learnt how to express herself..

but atm she can tell me whats going on and why shes crying.. :)

or i just learn what makes her angry or upset and dont do it,.,.

example* if were out shopping and im holding her hand.. and i hold her hand in a certain way she doesnt like it,, she will hav a whinge.. so now i no not to hold her hand that way.. saves the whinging.. hehe

GOODLUCK EVERYONE

[iamLilysmummy]

Well it comes down to teaching about love for us just as much as any emotion ....

We have a great set of books called ' When I'm Feeling ... ' these come in Angry, Jealous, Happy, Sad, Lonely, Loved, Kind & Scared ...

They are FANTASTIC & have helped so much with Boof because it has taught him that its fine & more than ok to be feeling angry or whatever but its just not acceptable to hurt others because we feel that way. It talks about taking themselves to their 'quiet place' & Boof now will often do this when he gets angry ( he goes & sits behind our dining table cause he can be alone there lol ) or to talk it out etc.

Obviously its harder with younger kids which is often why distraction & all those types of methods are used say under 2-3yrs depending on the child but really after 3yrs getting kids to use their words & start helping them towards explaining & understanding their feelings is the key IMO. They arent going to truly 'get it' but its the foundation for as they grow.
We have those books,.. theyr wonderful. :valentine:

[UmmInayah]

I have also noticed that minor things like changing the colour of the cup won't make a difference to my life (apart from having to wash an extra cup), but make my DD happy.

I guess we have to "pick our battles".. It is important that children learn it is not okay to hit people, throw objects etc, but really little things like them "getting their own way" when it comes to cups etc, make no difference to my life at all. (So yes, I will change the cup if my DD asks me to.. within reason - I won't do it 3 times for example :D)

And also I have been thinking.. why is it so wrong for children to get their way once in a while? Shame! I feel so sorry for children. Especially when I am in the car with my DD and she just has no other choice but to follow me around everywhere I go. DH and I always feel so sorry for her as she lies in the back while we drive.. So we go out of our way to offer her extra hugs on days we have to run errands or yes, we buy her an icypole or something

[reAllytee]

I agree Umm !!!

I dont understand why so many are rigid in the way they expect their kids to bow to their demands or their ideas of how they must act iykwim !

Gosh I change cups, plates or bluddy 50 toys at bedtime to keep the peace & because it simply isnt worth the fight that will see us up till midnite with a raging child.

Picking battles is certainly the way to go & I am also a strong believer in LISTENING to kids because there is NEVER any harm in allowing them power over their worlds ... We control soooo much of their lives & really whats the big deal allowing them to change to the red cup ????

[Areca]

ReALLYtee - the super long tantrums are fun aren't they? I hate it when DD1 gets started cause I just think 'oh great, here goes the next two hours.'
I really want those books you mentioned...waiting for them to come around again in the Scholastic book catalogue.

UmmInayah - I agree in the sense. I just ask DD1 now what cup she wants her drink in because it makes no difference to me at the end of the day. Or if I get her chair out for her and she wanted to get it then I absolutely give her the option of taking it back herself and bringing it back out. If I know she's close to breaking point already, I'll take it back myself just to avoid the two hour long tantrum. I don't think that's her getting her own way, I think it's part of letting them be people and make decisions too. At the same time, if I do get her chair for her and she didn't like that but I don't have time to take it back so she can get it herself then she needs to understand that she can do it next time, that I'm busy and was simply trying to be helpful. She can certainly come and talk to me about her feelings and I'll happily discuss them with her. But if she's going to have a tantrum over such a minor thing then I won't bother talking to her about it until she is rational again...because I CAN'T talk to her...she's irrational and trying to talk to her at that point just makes her worse.

I guess she's like me in that sense - If I'm upset with DH and don't feel like we're getting anywhere I get to the point where I need a time out myself so I can go and talk to him...I need to calm myself down or else I'll just get angrier and angrier and explode.

I do my best to teach my children by being a good example. I'm not perfect by any means and there are times where I yell and scream and it's totally unwarranted. But it's been great for me knowing that I have children watching me. I used to just yell at DH if I was upset with him...it was just my way of dealing with it. But now I'm far more rational and do my best to get my point across and talk to him without losing control of my own emotions. I know that I'm a lot less in control of my emotions when I'm tired...so I'll tell the kids that I'm tired and cranky and simply not in the mood. If need be I'll leave them and go and lock myself in my room for a few minutes why I calm down. I'm only human.

I don't have time outs in the sense of 'here stand in the 'naughty' corner for three minutes and be absolutely humiliated in front of everyone' but we do put DD1 in her bedroom and close the door if we need to because it's a safe place for her. As I'm carrying her to her room I will tell her that she's not going in there because she's in trouble, but because everyone needs to be safe. I then continue to check on her and offer her support if she is ready for it. Once she has calmed down we always talk. I never don't validate her feelings, or ignore the fact that she felt that way. We discuss why she got upset, how she felt, what she missed out on in the 45 minutes-two hours that she threw the tantrum for, we discuss whether what upset her was worth missing out on x,y and z and what would have been a better way to deal with the situation.
I also tell her that if she's getting upset that she can put herself in her room if she likes. Even if I'm halfway through telling her something, if she runs off and slams the door to her room I just leave it. We discuss it again when she comes back out.


It's just not that easy to decide that you aren't going to leave your child alone ever. Sometimes you're so frustrated yourself that it's better to leave them and have a break so you're ready to deal again, other times it's a practicality issue - I can't just let DD2 starve because it's time for me to cook dinenr but DD1 decides to have a melt down right when I'm about to start cooking dinner. And then, the majority of the time, it comes down to pure safety. The books recommend that when a child is at the hitting/belting point to wrap them up in a bear hug so they are not left alone but can't hurt anyone either. Tried it on several occassions...what I get is a demon child who tries her absolute hardest to get away from me and screams at the top of her lungs 'let me go, let me go. You're hurting me (I'm not), let me go' and she gets worse and her tantrums go on for much longer. It's kinder to give her the space she needs, let her know every few minutes I'm there for her when she's ready for a cuddle and to give her her space.

If we're out it depends. If I have time we just sit down and wait, if we don't I either carry DD2 or put her in the pram so we can get things done. We don't really deal with tantrums when out anymore with DD1 but if she does get upset she's quite happy to hold my hand, or just follow me. She doesn't stop dead in her tracks anymore. When they're ready they get a cuddle. I don't bribe or anything like that. If my child is going to get upset when we're out then the rest of the world will just have to deal...I'm not going to ask her to behave a certain way and reward her at the end for complying because at some point the promise of a lolly isn't going to work and I'd rather my two year old chuck a tantrum than my 6 year old.

[UmmInayah]

Yeah! Power to the children! :laughing:

But seriously, you're right Ally.. It really makes no difference what cup they have their beverage in. I know I prefer specific glasses for what I am drinking, so I imagine children would feel the same.

Although having said this, it IS very frustrating on days when my DD can't explain herself to me, and yes, I feel like just letting her cry and leave her to it because I can't deal with it. But I know that if I don't deal with the crying, it will bite me in the **** and only get worse if I leave it (ie distract her).. Which is what I have noticed happens at bed time!! The crying is SO much worse if I don't listen to it in the day.

[UmmInayah]

ReALLYtee - the super long tantrums are fun aren't they? I hate it when DD1 gets started cause I just think 'oh great, here goes the next two hours.'
I really want those books you mentioned...waiting for them to come around again in the Scholastic book catalogue.

UmmInayah - I agree in the sense. I just ask DD1 now what cup she wants her drink in because it makes no difference to me at the end of the day. Or if I get her chair out for her and she wanted to get it then I absolutely give her the option of taking it back herself and bringing it back out. If I know she's close to breaking point already, I'll take it back myself just to avoid the two hour long tantrum. I don't think that's her getting her own way, I think it's part of letting them be people and make decisions too. At the same time, if I do get her chair for her and she didn't like that but I don't have time to take it back so she can get it herself then she needs to understand that she can do it next time, that I'm busy and was simply trying to be helpful. She can certainly come and talk to me about her feelings and I'll happily discuss them with her. But if she's going to have a tantrum over such a minor thing then I won't bother talking to her about it until she is rational again...because I CAN'T talk to her...she's irrational and trying to talk to her at that point just makes her worse.

I guess she's like me in that sense - If I'm upset with DH and don't feel like we're getting anywhere I get to the point where I need a time out myself so I can go and talk to him...I need to calm myself down or else I'll just get angrier and angrier and explode.

I do my best to teach my children by being a good example. I'm not perfect by any means and there are times where I yell and scream and it's totally unwarranted. But it's been great for me knowing that I have children watching me. I used to just yell at DH if I was upset with him...it was just my way of dealing with it. But now I'm far more rational and do my best to get my point across and talk to him without losing control of my own emotions. I know that I'm a lot less in control of my emotions when I'm tired...so I'll tell the kids that I'm tired and cranky and simply not in the mood. If need be I'll leave them and go and lock myself in my room for a few minutes why I calm down. I'm only human.

I don't have time outs in the sense of 'here stand in the 'naughty' corner for three minutes and be absolutely humiliated in front of everyone' but we do put DD1 in her bedroom and close the door if we need to because it's a safe place for her. As I'm carrying her to her room I will tell her that she's not going in there because she's in trouble, but because everyone needs to be safe. I then continue to check on her and offer her support if she is ready for it. Once she has calmed down we always talk. I never don't validate her feelings, or ignore the fact that she felt that way. We discuss why she got upset, how she felt, what she missed out on in the 45 minutes-two hours that she threw the tantrum for, we discuss whether what upset her was worth missing out on x,y and z and what would have been a better way to deal with the situation.
I also tell her that if she's getting upset that she can put herself in her room if she likes. Even if I'm halfway through telling her something, if she runs off and slams the door to her room I just leave it. We discuss it again when she comes back out.


It's just not that easy to decide that you aren't going to leave your child alone ever. Sometimes you're so frustrated yourself that it's better to leave them and have a break so you're ready to deal again, other times it's a practicality issue - I can't just let DD2 starve because it's time for me to cook dinenr but DD1 decides to have a melt down right when I'm about to start cooking dinner. And then, the majority of the time, it comes down to pure safety. The books recommend that when a child is at the hitting/belting point to wrap them up in a bear hug so they are not left alone but can't hurt anyone either. Tried it on several occassions...what I get is a demon child who tries her absolute hardest to get away from me and screams at the top of her lungs 'let me go, let me go. You're hurting me (I'm not), let me go' and she gets worse and her tantrums go on for much longer. It's kinder to give her the space she needs, let her know every few minutes I'm there for her when she's ready for a cuddle and to give her her space.

If we're out it depends. If I have time we just sit down and wait, if we don't I either carry DD2 or put her in the pram so we can get things done. We don't really deal with tantrums when out anymore with DD1 but if she does get upset she's quite happy to hold my hand, or just follow me. She doesn't stop dead in her tracks anymore. When they're ready they get a cuddle. I don't bribe or anything like that. If my child is going to get upset when we're out then the rest of the world will just have to deal...I'm not going to ask her to behave a certain way and reward her at the end for complying because at some point the promise of a lolly isn't going to work and I'd rather my two year old chuck a tantrum than my 6 year old.

:iagree: wholeheartedly!

There are times when I have left my DD, only because I can't deal with the crying right there and then, but as mentioned in my previous post (sorry, only read yours after i posted!), I pay for it at bedtime.

I really don't think distraction works for my DD. And I do in a way feel like I am not validating her feelings when I do distract her. I know that I am doing it to prevent myself from having to deal with the crying right at that moment in time.

I don't reward my DD for complying either. I feel that is something that is expected, not something that should be praised. (I am even doing it now while my DD is toilet training.. I expect her to use the toilet when she needs to and she doesn't require praise as she knows that that's just the done thing!) i also don't want her to feel like she is doing something to make me happy, but rather doing it for herself on her own, if you know what i mean?

I guess I am lucky in that my DD hardly has tantrums and is generally a very understanding person. She is very easy to reason with and explains her feelings very well. She is very in touch with her emotions and feelings (except for her tired feelings :rolleyes:)

[OJandMe]

Tantrums are funny things. Until I had a 2 year old, I didn't know what a tantrum was....

When they turned 3.. I realised I was wrong about my first assumption... and now knew what a tantrum was..

When they turned 4 I realised I was wrong about my second assumption... I NOW knew what a tantrum was... and had the ability to either distract, laugh at or completely ignore the 2 yr old having a minor frustration about something in the other room.

I wonder what it will be like when they're 5.... :detective:

In my ouse I characterise tantrums as head spinning, throwing themselves on the floor, screaming, frothing at the mouth, kicking, screaming "yes yes yes yes yes yes!!!!" in the hope that I will give in or change my answer. And this continues for about 2 hours.

That's a tantrum. Anything else I can handle, normal acts of defiance, general frustrations at not being understood, or misunderstood.

Choose your battles, negotiate yes, compromise. I believe if you find ways to reach happy negotiations and compromises most of the time, then when you do say "no... and that's the end of it" they'll be more likely to respect that, because they know that if there was a way to compromise it, you wouldn't have a problem doing it.

[BabelFish]

I haven't had time to read the other long posts yet but just wanted to say - I agree that there should be times when children get their own way, of course! They need to feel empowered just the way everyone does.

But if it comes to having a major meltdown just because they don't get their own way, then I think there's a difference. I agree - don't sweat the small stuff, and pick your battles. We expect children to cooperate so I don't see any particular reason why WE shouldn't cooperate with them, too. If anything, it will help teach our kids that we are fair and reasonable, and consistent.

[Boobycino]

I agree Umm !!!

I dont understand why so many are rigid in the way they expect their kids to bow to their demands or their ideas of how they must act iykwim !

Gosh I change cups, plates or bluddy 50 toys at bedtime to keep the peace & because it simply isnt worth the fight that will see us up till midnite with a raging child.

Picking battles is certainly the way to go & I am also a strong believer in LISTENING to kids because there is NEVER any harm in allowing them power over their worlds ... We control soooo much of their lives & really whats the big deal allowing them to change to the red cup ????

:iagree:

I think you can potentially give yourself more power when you do say "no" if you only say it when you're prepared to see it through and its something that actually matters.

In theory... I'll let you know how it turns out when bubba is a toddler!

[justinonymous]

Tantrum: What we all wish we could do if we weren't restrained by ideas of "maturity".

:p