How Do I Overcome These Problems Next Time?

[MrsMiggins]

I'm just wondering if anyone's got any tips for success for me.

I was not able to successfully BF my DD & I really want to succeed second time round.

Here are a list of the problems which we had last time:


DD was a very "insistent" baby! The second she knew she was about to get a feed, she would get impatient & I don't think I ever once managed to get her on there while she was calm & relaxed. She was very strong & would push her head away from where I was trying to guide it & would have her arms in the way constantly, screaming the whole time
I have quite large, very heavy breasts & it was always awkward trying to get everything in the right position to be able to feed
I also have very flat nipples & large areola, so DD found it very difficult to latch onto anything
When I could manage to get her on correctly, she would pull straight back so that she was just on the nipple. It was as though it was uncomfortable for her to have any more than that in her mouth
While I read every piece of advice I could get my hands on, they all said the same thing when it came to attachment - "Place the baby's lower lip on the lower edge of your areola & then wait until the baby opens her mouth wide & gently guide her on" YEAH RIGHT!!! If I could have done that, I don't think there would have been any issue!! How on earth do you "gently place" a screaming, wriggling newborn's lower lip anywhere?!
The pain of the cracked & bleeding nipples in the end was so excrutiating it even hurt to express milk. I dreaded every single feed. Even the thought of having to feed her made me want to cry!
I kept getting different advice from all the midwives every time a shift changed. This was good in a way, as I got to try a variety of different things, but mainly it was just confusing & I ended up doing everything by halves, as I would try to do everything everyone said all at once


I think two of the main points are that I have very large, heavy breasts & flat nipples. I tried several different positions, but was never comfortable & always had to support DD's head with one hand & my breast with the other. Cushions. pillows etc were not much help, other than to support DD's body a bit. Lying on my side was completely out of the question, as was feeding in a sling etc.

Have any other mums with this same problem been able to BF successfully? How did you do it? Were you ever able to feed so that you had a free hand?

How do I avoid the severely cracked & bleeding nipples next time round? I did end up trying Lansinoh last time & found it to be quite good, but it didn't solve the problem.

How do you get a baby to latch on correctly when they just don't want to do it?

[the_queen]

Hey I know I replied in your other thread - but just thought that perhaps I could describe how I attach DS. I have ginormous boozies :D and it took some logistical planning :laughing:

Baby is in cradle hold position. With opposite hand (ie, left boob, right hand) I hold my boob with the thumb above the nipple, the 2nd finger up in the air (for now) third finger just under the nipple, and then 4th and 5th just where they naturally lay. Lift boob to bubs mouth, then 2nd finger goes above nipple, squeeze 2nd and 3rd together to flatten nipple out a bit. And by "flatten" I mean "make it pointy" LOL geez I"m articulate aren't I!??? By moving 2nd and 3rd fingers, you can move position of nipple to get it right in bubba's mouth. Rub nipple above bubs top lip, then as soon as he opens mouth, push nipple in using 2nd finger mostly to push, getting as much of the areola in as possible.

HTH.

Also, right from when DS was literally 2 minutes old, I have played a copying game with him, when he's looking into my eyes and we're really engaged, I open my mouth wide and then give him time to copy me. He won't get it straight away, but he did start copying me on about day 3. So now, if he's fussing or not opening his mouth properly, I give him cuddles to calm him down, then lay him back down on my arm and play the copying game, as soon as he opens his mouth I do my thang :laughing:

[reAllytee]

MrsMiggins hopefully Goosie will be along to help you out but you can also PM her so many girls on here get brilliant advice off her & she is always happy to help :thumbsup:


Sorry not the Queenie or the other mums here dont have great advice :o i think i shall take my foot out of my mouth now & shuffle back to my corner :o

[Areca]

To deal with arms flying around swaddle your baby, that way your baby can't flail. I know they say to unwrap so they wake up but if you're starting with a screaming baby that can get that under control.

Also, go to a bf'ing class whilst still pg!!

[xkwzit]

Can't help you with the ginormous boob issue, but here's a few things

Some babies hate to have their head held and "pushed" into position. I was told to support her head by holding the back of her neck and shoulders. This leaves her head free to tip backwards (imagine those solo ads, you drink with your head tilted back not forward), so try to allow her head to do this if she wants.

To get as much areola as poss in her mouth, Queenie is right about "flattening" it, like you would a huge hamburger before you tried to take a bite.

Book an appointment with an LC after the birth. All my middies gave different and conflicting advice which I found EXTREMELY frustrating. My LC was worth her weight in gold. I also had an appointment with her for DD2, even though we weren't having any where near the same problems, just to make sure I was doing everything right.

Cheers

[cheezelkat]

I still do the hanburger hold to get DS to latch on. It makes it much easier for the baby to get onto.

Definetley ook at getting a support network for when the baby is born. The more support you have, the better you will be at in overcoming your problems.

[shed]

I am also wanting to give this breastfeeding lark the best possible go.

I am using lansinoh cream every day (I am 34 weeks) and have been for a couple of weeks.

Where do I go for the classes or to find a lactation person?

I am in Sydney west.

I don't have ginormous ones so that's not a problem. I just need some direction really - if things aren't working I need to know who to turn to.

Sorry for hijacking, its just that I was going to start a similar thread.

[reAllytee]

I am also wanting to give this breastfeeding lark the best possible go.

I am using lansinoh cream every day (I am 34 weeks) and have been for a couple of weeks.

Where do I go for the classes or to find a lactation person?

I am in Sydney west.

I don't have ginormous ones so that's not a problem. I just need some direction really - if things aren't working I need to know who to turn to.

Sorry for hijacking, its just that I was going to start a similar thread.


I know last time we spoke ( ages ago now heh ) you were talking of birthing at Liverpool Hospital ? If you give them a call they are fantastic & have great consultants themselves who are very helpful but im even sure they can put you onto someone in the area :)
Otherwise have you tried the ABA ?

[Tam-I-Am]

Hey MrsMiggins,

Are you a member of the Australian Breastfeeding Association? If not - try their website (http://www.breastfeeding.asn.au/) - membership is $50 for 12 months, or $85 for 24 months. They have breastfeeding counsellors, and a breastfeeding support group. You can have face-to-face appointments with their counsellors to get help with breastfeeding, and I believe that they run classes before the baby is born. Of course, you can always contact their 24/7 helpline, which is free, and you don't need to be a member to use.

The other thing is, contact the maternity ward at the hospital where you're having your baby and ask for a referral to a lactation consultant either there, or a private lactation consultant that isn't attached to the hospital.

I also found I had trouble with every middie giving me conflicting advice. Either have your lactation consultant lined up before you go into labour - so they can be there to advise you after bubs is born - OR the thing that I found helped was to find only 1 or 2 middies with the same advice, who I trusted and got along well with - and follow their advise only.

Use lansinoh for a couple of weeks before bubs is born - just once a day - to condition your nipples and make them really supple. The advice that the-queen gave about making your nipple pointy is very good - the idea is just to get as much of your breast tissue into the baby's mouth as possible. Using the edge of the areola as an example is just that - an example. It doesn't work for everyone. But making sure that the baby's mouth is wide wide open, and getting as much of your breast tissue surrounding the nipple into the baby's mouth as possible is really important.

In all likelihood, you will have some troubel with sore cracked/bleeding nipples for the first couple of weeks - I don't know of many women who are learning to breastfeed who don't have these troubles, but remember that after a few weeks, this should settle down. For me, it was about 8 weeks. For lots, its less than that - about 2-6.

Good luck, I hope things work out for you. And PM me if you want a shoulder or a chat!:hugs:

[Goosie22]

Hi,

I would second the Breastfeeding Australia membership as very important and also finding yourself a Lactation Consultant.

Also Determination to succeed is very important, trying not to see the bad side of everything. It is said a lot by new mothers that it takes around 6 weeks to get everything in sinc.

Positioning is the key to correct attachment and without that it can be very painful and cause lots of damage to your nipples.

I would be happy to help you also when the time comes.

G:)

[hummingbird]

I also found midwives giving conflicting advice extremely frustrating. When I was getting very disheartened one night in hospital one midwife gave me a pearler that let me get my head back in the right space to start fresh. She simply reminded me that its all a learning process for the baby aswell. Sounds pretty obvious, but I thought that knowing how to attach was some innate thing babies are born with, like seeing animals on Discovery Channel. Fact is, babies aren't always going to know they need to open their mouths as wide can be to get what they are crying for. They are going to get as frustrated as we are that things aren't going 'according to plan'. More than anything this little reminder would let me wind down when getting upset or frustrated and remind myself that it was a team effort - me and bubs vs the boob, rather than me and boob vs bubs.

Sometimes too I would need DH there when latching on to help hold back bubs hands to keep them out of the way. If you are going to swaddle, just make sure their arms are to the side, not on their chest. Also, be prepared for the feed with pillows, a big glass of water etc so your mind is completely on the job.

With all the advice everyone's already given I am sure you will be giving it the best go you can.

[meme]

sometimes a rolled up washer or hand towel can help to support your breast and leave your hands a little free-er for supporting bubs.

feeding did take up both my hands at first as i had to hold my boob with one and bubs with the other, but quickly bubs grew and learnt how to attach well herself and also as she got bigger she fitted my boob in her mouth better too.

it can take some time to establish breastfeeding, 6wks(*not saying it will take this long, but it can.) can sound like a long time, but in the bigger picture babies really do grow so fast. once you've got it it is so easy and rewarding.

the best way to avoid the sore nipples is to get attachment right, and the best place to get good info on that is the ABA.

any book by sue cox is also good.

best of luck. preparing now is a great idea.

[Jo_Jo]

oh MrsMiggins,

reading what you said was what i went through!! i BF with my 1st with no probs and with my 2nd only a couple of weeks but my 3rd who was 11 years after well as i said had all the probs you discribe along with the booby,s and nipples and screaming bubby and by 6 weeks developed a 7cm abcess in my left breast, hospital surgery the works but i was so head strong everyone was telling me give it up but i kept going and ej is now 14 months and i still am breastfeeding but only with my right booby it took so long for my left to heal and i could not feed him as they had cut me along my areola for the surgery......as i look back god the first 4 months were so bloody traumatic and hard but im so glad i persisted some people thought i was crazy but everything thrown at me i kept saying to bub nup where gonna beat this and we did i have never breastfed this long the longest was 6 months and i love it, i have tried to put him on my left as it still produces little amounts of milk but he just laughs at it....lol i make sure i express it myself just so i don,t get any built up ducts.......i do know that breastfeeding can be very hard for alot of mums and does not come as natural as we would all like to think but with the help of the ABA and your local lactation midwifes and a hell of alot of persistants, patiants, and a real want to do it you will get there, at the moment im not ready to stop and ej, well he just loves the booby, after all we went through i will be sad when i eventually ween him off, and when we go for #4 i will do it all again...lol good luck:thumbsup:



cheers....jo:ecomcity:

[MrsMiggins]

Wow! Thanks so much everyone!! There have been some really great, great posts on here!!

One of the problems I had that I just had no idea how to overcome was how to stop DD battling me every time we went in for a feed! I noticed a couple of people on here suggested swaddling, which we tried to do, but that only made matters worse because she just hated being wrapped & refused to have anything to do with it! It was so frustrating for all of us, as it only made her more upset. And she was so strong - and I mean incredibly, unbelievably strong! I never imagined a newborn could have such strength! Basically, if she didn't want to put her head or her arms or whatever in the position we were trying to have her in, then short of forcing her far beyond what I would have been happy doing, then it just wasn't going to happen. :no: Hopefully this one will be somewhat more co-operative! :yes:

A friend of mine that I have met since Claire was born (who is a nurse), told me recently that she has a neighbour who is a lactation consultant & that she was able to help her when her DD was born. So I'm hoping to be able to get hold of her before the birth of this little one, as apparently she is very, very good.

I definitely want a LC this time, as I wanted one last time, but had no idea how to get in touch with one & by the time I felt capable of getting out & about with bub, & getting things like that organised, it was too late.

And Goosie, I may just take you up on your offer for some advice when the time comes! :thumbsup:

[xkwzit]

Two things
If the LC visits you in hospy, it may well be free (mine was) and the hospital can get one in for you. But if you've got a personal rec even better.

Yes, babies can be frustratingly strong, I remember sometimes getting DH to grab an arm or two so that I could get DDs on. Too busy shoving their hands in their mouths to take a breast:rolleyes: . You can sometimes wedge the lower arm in with your body, the upper arm can be real tricky. fFortunately, it only lasts for a fairly short time before baby works out how this feeding caper happens and that fingers don't really help at all.:D

Persistance overcomes resistance.

Cheers

[JorBai]

Hi Mrs Miggins,

I had so many troubles breast feeding with DS so next time I am going to try the Avent Nipplette. It apparently draws out the nipple and is a permanent correction. Since having DS my nipples have come out a little but I am going to try the nipplette just so they come out and are easier for baby to latch onto. I think they cost about $60 so if you team that up with seeing a LC then you probably have a better chance of successfully breast feeding with your next bubba.

Good Luck and let me know how you go. I would love to hear feed back from someone in a similar situation to me.

[KiLLaKaZ]

shed - just wanted to let u know not to stress about BFing. i read up on it a little before Q. was born, but it turned out i didn't need to as Q. seemed to know EXACTLY what to do straight after birth! i know not everyone's lucky enough to have such a good feeder, but i wanted to let u know that it does happen, i think confidence & knowledge is the key to successful breastfeeding, so have a look at a few diagrams of correct attachment ;)

also, so far i haven't had ANY problems with my nipples - i didn't condition them or anything. they were a bit sensitive for the first few days, but now i can hardly feel Q. sucking away!! also, u don't necessarily need creams for sore/ cracked nipples. i was told to spread a bit of my milk onto the nipples after a feed & let it dry & that apparently does the trick. i was also told to expose them to sunlight a little... tho i haven't tried that yet, either ;)