personal attacks on freebirthers guised as discussion of reasonable birth choices

[demeter]

Alright my fellow brethren, I require vent space and cuddles from the other insane birthers like moi ;)

I am tired of being told by people who not only don't freebirth, but don't like freebirth for whatever personal reasons they might be, why it is that I chose it and why it is that I like it.

EXCUUUUUUUUSE YOU! I will be the judge of why I chose what I chose and what it means to my family and I. NOT anyone else! :shame:

I have my reasons, but I do not have to give them to anyone else, they're mine.

I'm not an idiot, I think before making choices, especially when the welfare of my child is involved. To assume otherwise is to be a presumptuous, rude, and seriously WRONG.

In the past 24 hours it has been suggested to me that I chose to freebirth because I am misinformed and uneducated and implied that I did it because other people did and I wanted them to like me :eek::rolleyes: And that my birth was unnaturally long and this was probably because I lead a lifestyle that is "sedentary" (read: my birth would not have taken long if I wasn't lazy).

This boggles my mind! My home birth with no medical presence, no interventions, which unfolded in it's own time, respected by those present, was unnatural because it took as long as it needed to take????

Does that mean the natural thing would have been to go to hospital and get my baby needlessly caesareaned out?

Obviously whatever happened at my freebirth was a-ok coz the closest thing either DD or I had to a negative outcome was my vagina grazed during 2nd stage.

*jumps off soapbox*
takes :chillpill:

[Nowhere]

HUGS im not a home birther or free birther, but wanted to send hugs anyway, ( hopeyou dont mind) I cant fathem how the heck anny moron can in any way shape or form think in any way there could be anything un natural about the birth, They couldnt come up with anything so atacked the time what idiots

You and the other free and home birthing mums on here seem to be more clued up on birth than most becuase you reserch it all your selfs rather then listening an OB that thinks birth should go as they read in a text book

:hugs:

[demeter]

HUGS im not a home birther or free birther, but wanted to send hugs anyway, ( hopeyou dont mind)
I don't mind! Thanks! :)

[Freya]

:hugs::hugs:

I know what you mean...

And I also get the ' You're 18 how could it have possibly been an informed decision to freebirth'.:thumbsdown::thumbsdown:

It was our choice and no ones business but ours.

[Ana Gram]

Unnaturally long because you are lazy?? Man that made me do a squinty face. I must have been super lazy since mine took 31 hours in hospital.

:hugs:

[gizmoduckus]

:hugs: I am so sorry that some people don't know when to keep their rude comments to themelves.

[NibbleCurlynBub]

That sucks Demeter.

ALL birth choices are reasonable, viable choices.

I must be lazy too.
Though I think any woman who has endured a long labour would know that going through that is FAR from lazy. It takes a lot of effort and energy, actually. :no:

[LoveMyBoys]

Sounds like theyre jealous to me!! or just plain ignorant!!

[Luna Lovegood]

Hmmm :detective:

:hugs::hugs:

I hate people who judge others for things that dont affect their own lives in anyway. People should really mind their own business...

:goodvibes:


OP- very well written post, was most amused.

[MordecaiAliVanAllenO'Shea]

I didnt know you freebirthed Harriet demeter! We were in the same "due in" thread - Feb 2008, and I never knew. It's probably why you werent as much in the chat towards the end, while we were all discussing hospitals etc, you lucky thing were preparing for your little girl at home.

Sorry, completely off topic :o (And how fast did our bubs grow up hey!?)

[MimiGrace]

:hugs: i'm sorry you got such unpleasant comments.

I'm not a homebirther/freebirther (yet :goodvibes:, so i'm here unofficially :laughing:), but i know how much you girls research (and i thank you for it, helps me in the future :thumbsup:).

I can't even imagine someone implying your lazy or stupid because you choose to have the perfect birth [for you]. Sounds like jealousy to me!!!

[JabberJaw]

OK i am going to answer this one because * although i would have never said anything to yr face* I WAS uninformed, knew nothing of home birth before bub hub, and honestly never saw any benefits, just the "bad" stuff that could go wrong!

I have since changed my opinion. I now know there are lots of benefits, and also that more could probably go wrong in hospital, where you would also *possibly* receive more intervention than is necessary.

So that is the other side to the story, and no doubt WHY you get comments (although i think it is pretty rude) it is because people are uninformed and think the 'medical model' of childbirth is the best and safest.

So keep educating educating educating, it has turned my thinking around for sure.

I am sorry you got dreadful comments, but people often say dumb things when they cant grasp the concept or are uninformed :D

[misskittyfantastico]

I didnt know you freebirthed Harriet demeter! We were in the same "due in" thread - Feb 2008, and I never knew. It's probably why you werent as much in the chat towards the end, while we were all discussing hospitals etc, you lucky thing were preparing for your little girl at home.

Sorry, completely off topic :o (And how fast did our bubs grow up hey!?)

Me too - though not in the Feb thread. Hamish was a Feb bub. Our bubs are BIG! Harriet is a very fortunate bub and you are a very special mum.

[MyFourCubs]

I am nto aware of the threads you are referring to but I am sorry you are upset- I don't feel comfortable with the idea of homebirth or freebirth and I will be honest, when I first started to read your birth story about a year ago I thought you were MAD:laughing: but I have since read through your blogs etc and while I still would not do it in a pink fit I know that you are very well educated, well informed and perfectly capable of weighing up the risks and making the best desicions for you and your child. You did and are doing a wonderful job:)

I will say though that the insults and put downs fly all ways on this forum unfortuantely- I often feel that I am the uneducated one and the uninformed one for making the birth choices I made and I have gotten upset many a time on this forum because of it. But it doesn't matter what topic it is there is always two sides to it and not always friendly. A shame but inevitable I guess.

Cheer up and try not to take it personally- I dont' anymore.:hugs:

[rainbow road]

Yep, so lazy! I completely agree. I think it's lazy how you spent hours and days and months researching freebirth, planning your birth, planning your contingencies, planning, planning, planning.

I mean, what you should have done was duck down to the local hospy, let them do to you what would have definitely been in your best interests without asking any questions and you would definitely have a more well adjusted and happy bub than Harriet is now. :rolleyes:

Shame on you demeter :shame:

FOR CRYING OUT LOUD, I am so sick of ignorance when it comes to childbirth!!!! I take my hat off to anyone who makes an informed decision as to how they will birth be it c-sec, hospy, freebirth or whatever.

Demeter, your birth story was the most incredible and inspirational one I have EVER read!! So do me a favour and tell these people to shove their opinions up their own sedentary bottoms.

Yay for Freebirthers!:yelclap:

[confusd]

HUGS im not a home birther or free birther, but wanted to send hugs anyway, ( hopeyou dont mind):hugs:

i thought id add some aswell :hugs:





I know what you mean...

And I also get the ' You're 18 how could it have possibly been an informed decision to freebirth'.:thumbsdown::thumbsdown:

It was our choice and no ones business but ours.

DERRRRR, im sorry but that is just one of the stupidest comments i have read. :no: i cant believe people have actually said that to you.

[demeter]

Thank-you all :)


Demeter, your birth story was the most incredible and inspirational one I have EVER read!! So do me a favour and tell these people to shove their opinions up their own sedentary bottoms:laughing: I literally laughed out loud at that last line!

MyThreeCubs the comments weren't made on bubhub, or on any forum for that matter, so you haven't missed anything.

JaidevsMum and TabulaRasa; yay for Feb bubs :D And you're right JaidevsMum, I didn't have much in common in those threads, especially at the end, plus I'm notoriously bad at keeping up with active chat threads. I can manage it for a week and then I forget to check and fall too far behind.

Back to OP. I do have moments when I doubt myself and occasionally think "wow! Did I really do that? Was that stupid?" Then remember all the planning, remember how I felt at the time; so in tune and clear about what was necessary and what was not. Sometimes it's like thinking about another woman - there is just something about the space of pregnancy and birth that is so different to the rest of the time, I find.

I don't know if all my babies will be freeborn, I don't know if the next one will be. A wise friend of mine always says that you can't know what will be right for that birth until you are close to the time. So at the moment I think "it would be lovely to birth our next baby at home alone, this time without doulas" (coz my fondest memories are of the 15 or so hours DH and I did on our own), but I know it's pointless make birth plans now, a year away from TTC, because who we are then (and by the time we're due) will be completely different to now, and what we will need will be different.

I've just got to trust that when the next time comes that same certainty will rise up inside me and I'll know what to choose.

I am just so fed up with news articles that bang on about the controversy of freebirthing that are under-researched and over-sensationalised and get the knickers of those around me in a twist :rolleyes:

Anyway I've :ecomcity: enough for now lol

[kymmy]

I hear ya.
Oh women can choose the way to birth BUT....
only if its safe, this, that etc - safe for who and who sets the standard?

Imagine choosing to birth on your own. :eek:

Its frustrating but I am learning a lot about other people and myself.

Having had 3 hospital births with midwives and a freebirth I know which I prefer.

[Tam-I-Am]

I think it's important to remember that when people make comments like that, it's a reflection of where THEY'RE at - not a reflection of you, your choices, or your position in life at all.

I find that a lot of my choices challenge the people around me for whatever reason. And when people are challenged, their first, instinctive reaction is usually to go on the defensive, to defend what they've done and how they've done it. And we all know the best form of defensive is attack, right?

Freebirth is not a choice I'd make - at least not right now, not where I am at the moment. Possible not ever (but I agree with you - you can't say what you'll do until you're in that situation!). I recognise that it challenges ME when others freebirth. My first reaction is to get defensive about MY choices - why I felt I wanted a midwife at my homebirth, why I birthed the way I did, why I made the choices I did. To effectively defend what I did, would usually require me ripping what YOU did to shreds, if that makes sense. It's only when I step back from the process and try to understand it that I realise it has very little - or really nothing - to do with you. It's all about me, my conceptualisations, my defenses, my decisions etc.

So try not to take it on board, is the moral of the story - you did what was right for you and your family. Your little girl is here, and safe, and well, and oh-so loved. Therefore it was the right decision :) The people who are challenged by that will continue to be so, and most won't critically evaluate why, or even recognise that their inherent mislike of your actions springs from a place of being challenged about their own stuff. Until they do, unfortunately, you will continue to have misinformed, challenged people giving you flack. Water off a duck's back :hugs:

[AM]

freebirthers rock :laughing:

[mrsdj1234]

*HUGS*
It really irritates me that people think that just because you freebirthed, that you didn't take precautions, do research and just generally put your baby's life in jeopardy.
Sorry that people are being poopy heads.

I agree with you Kymmy. 2 Hospy births and freebirth, I know which one I prefer. Now if only I can convince DH to go for #4.

[naiwen]

Being completely honest I dont think I could ever feel totally comfortable with the idea of a birth where no medical professional was present.

Having said that I stand by every woman's right to choose the birth she wants and I admire freebirthers for having so much confidence their bodies and nature.

I think their is a place for discussion but not for nasty comments like th ones you received :hugs:.

[forbetoel]

People have no right to be so rude to you.

But if I may play devils advocate here - most people don't know anything about free birth, and it isn't really their fault. It is hardly reported in the media and you won't see it advertised in hospitals, so I think it is sort of normal for people to be a little freaked out that someone gives birth with no medical back up.

Seriously unless you are apart of a parenting forum there is a good chance that you would think freebirth is only done in African tribes. Mainstream Australia doesnt know that many, many women freebirth without any troubles at all, and most certainly be more satisfied.

Anyway, hope you get my point, and I am so sorry for any negativity you have had to put up with.

I for one am jealous of your wonderful birth - well done!

[jag5000]

I think it's important to remember that when people make comments like that, it's a reflection of where THEY'RE at - not a reflection of you, your choices, or your position in life at all.

I find that a lot of my choices challenge the people around me for whatever reason. And when people are challenged, their first, instinctive reaction is usually to go on the defensive, to defend what they've done and how they've done it. And we all know the best form of defensive is attack, right?

Freebirth is not a choice I'd make - at least not right now, not where I am at the moment. Possible not ever (but I agree with you - you can't say what you'll do until you're in that situation!). I recognise that it challenges ME when others freebirth. My first reaction is to get defensive about MY choices - why I felt I wanted a midwife at my homebirth, why I birthed the way I did, why I made the choices I did. To effectively defend what I did, would usually require me ripping what YOU did to shreds, if that makes sense. It's only when I step back from the process and try to understand it that I realise it has very little - or really nothing - to do with you. It's all about me, my conceptualisations, my defenses, my decisions etc.

So try not to take it on board, is the moral of the story - you did what was right for you and your family. Your little girl is here, and safe, and well, and oh-so loved. Therefore it was the right decision :) The people who are challenged by that will continue to be so, and most won't critically evaluate why, or even recognise that their inherent mislike of your actions springs from a place of being challenged about their own stuff. Until they do, unfortunately, you will continue to have misinformed, challenged people giving you flack. Water off a duck's back :hugs:

wonderful post Tam!

and I agree totally... I find it hard to articulate why c/s is the right decision for ME without it sounding like a form of attack on those that choose differently. Just as (for example) homebirthers may be passionate about their choice and often state how 'sad' they feel that women are given c/s etc.. well, that offends me. BUT it shouldn't! I am totally pro CHOICE when it comes to birthing... that includes your choice.. or mine.

of course most of the statements I have read in all your posts about the ignorant and downright rude comments others have made to you deserve a huge :hugs:.. debate is one thing.. a lack of manners is another entirely! I truly am sorry that you had to hear it.

[sandy cheeks]

:hugs:
While i wouldnt have a homebirth myself I think its ur right to choose how u birth ur child.
I too knew not much about home/free birth before bubhub and thought it was a hippy way of giving birth since being on here I have a new respect for it the ladys that do it arnt just hippys(well maby some r:p) going against the norm they r well informed and have had to organise everything themselves as well as take responsibility for the outcome good or bad, so stuff what anyone else tells u it's not their body or family u made the best/right choice for u and dd and the outcome was perfect.:thumbsup:

[BreithCuidiu]

This takes me back to when I was the "star" of the hospital where I gave birth to my first baby.

I pushed the boundaries by wanting to give birth in the newly established, but never used, birth center.

I refused to have an epidural, gas, pethidine or to have my waters broken.

My labour progressed slowly (a couple of days of prelabour and 20 hours regular, 3 minutely contractions), yet I refused syntocin.

I also refused synto for birth of the placenta (they gave it to me anyway and pretended they had no idea that it was so important).

I was labelled by some as "non compliant", and by others as a "poster mum for naural birth". Some were in awe (this was 15 years ago), and others were disgusted that I put my baby at risk. The one thing that I do know is that despite the fact that I'd never do it any other way, I will always remember the finger pointing and the accusations. Do people really think that Mothers would choose to birth their babies unsafely? We're not idiots. We're not asking for a medal (love that pearler of a comment). And we're certainly not in it for a dead baby.

So it seems the simple solution is for "medical staff" and "well meaning idiots" to keep their stupid mouths shut and let us birth in peace.

Done!

[Phyllis Stein]

Vent away, I totally get how frustrating that must be. :hugs:

The thing it comes back to for me is ownership of choice. A woman who freebirths is blatantly owning their own choice, taking full responsibility for their birth. And that's deeply threatening to a strongly patriarchal society.

[SuperGranny]

hi, just to go back to a comment about a long labour because of a 'lazy' mother. My last birthing, took the longest time, and was the most medically assisted of all of them and all of them were in hospital. I think if I had my time again, I would like to try a home birth or at least one with no medical 'assistance', but in my days there was no other choice. I agree with Tam, the others opinions are just their opinions, not meant as personal attacks, but sometimes the words come out wrong. Marie.

[BreithCuidiu]

I think the notion of freebirth or even natural birth, is horribly confronting to those living in a patriarchal/risk-minus-evidence society. Unfortunately this is the world in which we live :(

[MimiGrace]

Vent away, I totally get how frustrating that must be.

The thing it comes back to for me is ownership of choice. A woman who freebirths is blatantly owning their own choice, taking full responsibility for their birth. And that's deeply threatening to a strongly patriarchal society.
:iagree::iagree::iagree:

[Hooves]

I want to offer hugs to you too:hugs::hugs:

Every woman deserves the right to make her own choices about how she births her baby.

I had never even heard of freebirth until today. SO there ya go, I have learned again.


It is not something I would do, because I am scared whitless of labour and birth. AND I can't see that changing, in a hurry. :no:

BUT more power to those who have the courage, to do this. AND shame on anyone, who would say such terrible things, as you beng LAZY!!

I was horrified by that one. OMG. :hair:

Why can't people just be supportive of each other, and respect the fact, that your choices, are your choices. :confused:

AND good for you, may not be good for someone else. SO agree to disagree, if that is the best you can offer.

Birth is such a huge thing for us to be able to do, we each cope differently, have different opinions, different strengths, weaknesses.

BUT we all have the same goal at the end, to have a healthy baby, and to do what we feel is right for our families.

That is one common bond we all share.

AND I am so very sorry, that anyone would be so atrocious, to you. :hugs: