View Full Version : Formula Companies
Setting aside for the moment the breast vs formula feeding debate, I would like to discuss the very rich and powerful Infant Formula Companies and their ability to continue to get away with the most amazing things!
Formula companies have been tinkering and changing their products - and making mistakes! - over the years, and the guinea pigs for their experiments have been the babies fed the formula! They continue to change the recipes regularly - in what they know is a futile attempt to replicate breastmilk - and the present system is quite inadequate in keeping tabs on the production and addition of new ingredients etc
[Some of the inadequacies of the present regulations are pointed out in the Book 'Infant Formula: Evaluation of the Addition of Ingredients New to Infant Formula'.]
http://www.iom.edu/report.asp?id=19034&referrer=Google
But the one thing that concerns me at the moment is that, despite the fact that formula has consistently been shown to contain harmful bacteria [since the 1980's as far as I know], which is known to have actually caused the death of babies - the most recent in a NZ hospital in 2004 -
http://www.infactcanada.ca/INFACT%20Summer+Fall%202004%20Pg8-12.pdf
- they are still able to produce and sell their products with no warning label necessary!
A World Health Organization (WHO) publication [2005] states:-
http://www.who.int/foodsafety/publications/micro/mra6/en
"Intrinsic contamination of powdered formula with E. sakazakii or Salmonella can cause infection
and illness in infants, including severe disease, and can lead to serious developmental sequelae and
death."
"E. sakazakii has caused disease in all age groups. From the age distribution of reported cases,
it is deduced that infants (children <1 year) are at particular risk."
"... noted that as well as E. sakazakii there were a number of other pathogens of concern that may be present in powdered infant formula, such as Clostridium botulinum, Staphylococcus aureus and other Enterobacteriaceae ..."
"Using current dry-mix technology, it does not seem possible to produce commercially sterile powders or to completely eliminate the potential of contamination."
Even the most recent changes in regulations for formula products in Australia and NZ - FSANZ -Improvements to the regulation of Infant Formula Products 2002 - fails to mention the need for this labeling.
http://www.foodstandards.gov.au/whatsinfood/infantformulaproducts/improvementstothereg1393.cfm
I just think more people should be aware of this - and more of us should be ANGRY and vocal!! Perhaps if parents were aware and kicked up more of a fuss, maybe these issues would be seen to be more important - and perhaps be dealt with more adequately!?
madvoice
18-06-2005, 13:03
I think that this is a very well written and though out post. I never really thought that much into formula before (even though I'm breastfeeding). These companies should be accountable for what goes into it. Its rather shocking.
I have participated in a boycott of Nestle products for many years because of their unethical business methods in third world countries - they give free samples to women in hospital, thus drying up their milk supply and then they have little choice but to buy the formula and mix it with dirty water .
Here's a link to the Nestle Boycott website:
http://www.babymilkaction.org/pages/boycott.html
jarrahsmumma
18-06-2005, 21:43
hi,
fair enough for your own views, but when you have no ther options but formula you feel guilty enough without having to read posts like this
on another matter i use heinz formula as they are GE (genetically engineered) free this goes for their rice cereal and other baby food
i advise mummas to check out greenpeace's website for lists of what baby foods are GE free...
http://www.truefood.org.au/index2.html
Hi Natalie
I DID mention putting ASIDE that particular debate in my original post...
The only part of the post that is my opinion, is that I think more people should be aware and complain about it! The rest is pure fact... and and I can't see how keeping the facts from people is a good idea at all. If a woman cannot breastfeed, there should be no guilt in the fact that this is what one feeds their baby. Commercial infant formula is the only sensible and reasonable alternative available, OBVIOUSLY!!- and those who do use formula obviously expect that the product they give is as safe as it possibly can be. If there is a problem that needs to be addresssed, the best thing to get it changed is public outrage - a money making business does NOT like bad publicity!
Just remember, it is the formula and the formula companies that are under fire here - NOT the formula feeders! and if mothers do make a fuss over the unscrupulous behaviour of some companies and DO make a difference, then the ones to benefit from that are the formula fed babies - and their parents!
Nel09
Just wondering what the heinz formula is called and is it available in supermarkets? I live out of town and haven't been in to have a look.
Thanks amy
mumofethan
19-06-2005, 10:42
Hi,
The heinz formula is called Nurture... I use it and have never had a problem with it.
:D
Michelle
Thanks Michelle, i'll switch him over to that one when this tin finished, make me feel a little better at least being GE free.
madvoice
19-06-2005, 12:49
I'll keep the Heinz in mind as I'm looking at switching over to formula when I return to work. I'm in no big hurry as I don't go back until 31st October and Raleigh will be 7 months old. I've heard quite a few negative things about Nestle so I'm not surprised to hear about what you've posted.
I think it is probably important to note here, that ALL infant formula companies are refusing to label their powdered formula products, "This is not a sterile product ... etc" - despite the fact that they are NOT sterile.
All formula powders are at equal risk of bacterial contamination.
Sorry, I didn't mean to be insenstive to Mum's who have to use formula - it is obviously a very hard decision to make - I should have been more considerate about that.
I don't look down on women who use formula, but I do look down on companies like Nestle that cause the deaths of hundreds of thousands of babies every year in poor counties by actively stopping women from breastfeeding, just so they can make more money.
If companies like Nestle acted in an ethical manner and just provided formula for mothers who need it, I wouldn't have a problem with them.
jarrahsmumma
20-06-2005, 16:23
hi there,
i have found the heinz nuure formula mixes well and smells ok too, i had previously used Karicare and found it didn't mix well at all and would block up the teat, it also had a gross smell.
they also make a follow on 6 months formula and a toddler on in green and red tins (nuture under 6 months) is a blue tin. Almost all coles have it.
my CHN said the SMA or S26 uses animal fats in its formula, not too sure what she meant by this, i assume all formula (except soy/goats milk) uses animal fats? does anyone know if there is a difference?
thanks
Don't know if this will be of any help - but there is some information on content of some formula powders at ...
http://www.medic8.com/healthguide/articles/infantformula.htm
I don't look down on women who use formula, but I do look down on companies like Nestle that cause the deaths of hundreds of thousands of babies every year in poor counties by actively stopping women from breastfeeding, just so they can make more money.
Yes, and would you believe they went into the Tsunsami ravaged areas and were teaching women how to mix formula as their theory was that shock would have stopped them from breastfeeding. This is actually a very big myth and the formula companies perpetuated it. Many of the women at the formula mixing sessions were actually still successfully breastfeeding! Additionally, formula feeding in a Tsunami ravaged area is so dangerous as where would the women get the clean water to make it or the resources to boil the water. It is putting children's lives at serious risk.
I personally have no opinions about parents who feed formula, but I do get upset with the Formula companies and their tactics in third world countries and the like.
Yes I agree Milly - but it is not only in the third world that the formula companies are doing damage!!
I am amazed that , as far as I know, there are still no routine checks of each batch of formula - resulting in some very bad mistakes occuring! I will list a few - by no means is this a comprehensive, all-inclusive list... and these are just the ones we are AWARE of!!
In 1990, children in a a special care nursery in Australia were sick from faulty infant formula. The company, when informed, dutifully recalled the offending formula and it was replaced.
In 1992, infant formula was found to have excessive concentrations of vitamin D - discovered when formulas were sampled for it. 7 out of 10 samples contained over 200% and up to 419% of the amount stated on the label. Vit D being toxic in high doses!
In 1999, in America, 120,000 cans Enfamil and Prosobee were recalled due to a labeling mistake - they may have contained an adult nutritional supplement.
In 2003 three infant deaths in Israel. The German formula company acknowledged a production error, saying the formula contained too little of a vitamin that is vital for babies' development -contained only about one-tenth or less of the advertised quantity of Vitamin B1.
2004 The Canadian Food Inspection Agency (CFIA) and Mead Johnson Nutritionals warned consumers not to use the powder Enfalac Pregestimil Hypoallergenic Infant Formula. The affected product contained an incorrect size of scoop, which would result in the prepared formula being overconcentrated.
June 2004 A recall of Nestle Nan 1 Probiotic Starter Infant Formula- because an, 'Incorrect mix of formulation may have occurred during manufacturing process.' ... 'may cause babies to become unsettled. ... also cause constipation and/or diarrhoea and fewer wet nappies.'
These mistakes keep happening - as I said, these are just the ones we know about!!
I don't think the wealth and power of these companies should be underestimated at all. Heinz-Watties has such a hold over the NZ Ministry of Health [they provide money for the Plunkett Baby Clinics] that the NZ government cannot increase their recommendations for solid introduction to the standard 6 months - from their present 4 months.
A worry isn't it?
It is surprising that there isn't more testing of formula before it leaves the factory. After all it is going to the most vulnerable members of our comunity and I'm not sure how long a tin of formula lasts, but presumably several weeks - so in effect each tin is the sole source of nourishment for a precious life for an extended period of time.
It is too pathetic for words that more care isn't taken by formula companies to ensure each tin sold is safe for babies :( .
sopolicha
21-06-2005, 09:27
I know when I had to make formula for my girl, for some reason I would chuck the tin out after a week of it being opened. It would have been because of something written on the can.
I would imagine that as long as you keep the spoon used to measure the formula clean and dry (I used to sterlise it) and did not let stuff into the tin it should be okay.
I agree with what everyone has posted, unfortunately the majority of people with babies are a captive audience and are easy prey for big companies with loads of money and clever marketing eg sponsoring baby clinics. I think that is a disgrace.
Whatever ladies.......despite all the gloom and doom....millions of babies worldwide also survive and thrive from the availability of formula and it's naive to think that companies would spend hundreds of millions of dollars bringing a product to market and then not aggressively market it!! Of course they do - that's what business is all about.......
Mimi - IMO - this thread is to constructively assist women who are bottlefeeding - not subtly have a go at them for feeding their children contaminated formula or whatever it is that you are trying to do here. If you were as atuned and sensitive to the issue as you claim to be - then you wouldn't be posting such aggressive and potentially misleading and harmful posts.
Sure - there are occassional problems with almost ANY product that is on the market and it shouldn't happen - but it does - unfortunately nothing in life is ever perfect and human beings do make mistakes.............also - where is all the outrage when a women is pushed to continue breastfeeding and their baby suffers? My mother nearly starved my sister to death and I know of several other similar cases where this happened because breastfeeding advocates pushed mums to continue when clearly there was an indication to use formula....I would consider these children suffer quite badly - but no one dares to say anything about these cases or be "outraged" :mad:
My anger at reading this thread was that it's yet another thinly disguised attempt to intimidate bottlefeeding parents and add to their fear and guilt that they are somehow harming their child by giving them formula..........if you are so outraged - contact the media and get yourself on national television or something - post in other areas of the forum which are more suited to anger and debate.......
T
Tannie
As you said this section is for 'constructively helping women who are bottlefeeding'- and part of constructive help surely is INFORMATION. I am sure that there are many who would be happy not to know the truth about many things, but personally I think it is patronising to presume that there are certain things people 'need not know'.
This particular thread is discussing the continued unethical behaviour of these companies and it's purpose is twofold - and doesn't include the purposes you suggested
i.e. to 'subtly have a go at' mothers OR an
'attempt to intimidate bottlefeeding parents and add to their fear and guilt'
My purpose was
1. To inform those using the product that, though it would be expected that because this product is used to sustain the lives of our most vulnerable -little babies - still, adequate checks are not made of the product, and inadequate labelling continues.
2. That if enough people are aware of this then they will complain to the companies and get things changed - for the better of course.
The power of 'the customer' is huge, as found by the 'Baby Milk Action', which has a Campaign for Ethical Marketing. They state,
'Companies are concerned about their images. They usually refuse to make changes ..., but once they begin to receive letters from the general public they sometimes act.'
Your post highlights something else that most people are not aware of - as you said
'it's naive to think that companies would spend hundreds of millions of dollars bringing a product to market and then not aggressively market it!!'
When in fact it is illegal for formula companies to advertise. The International Code of Marketing of Breastmilk Substitutes bans all promotion of bottle feeding and sets out requirements for labelling and information on infant feeding. Any activity which undermines breastfeeding also violates the aim and spirit of the Code. The Code and its subsequent World Health Assembly Resolutions are intended as a minimum requirement, for protecting infant health, in all countries. Resolutions have been adopted every 2 years since 1982 because it is necessary to close many of the loopholes exploited by the industry.
Companies may not:
• promote their products in hospitals, shops or to the general public
• give free samples to mothers or free or subsidised supplies to hospitals or maternity wards
• give misleading information
• There should be no contact between baby milk company sales personnel and mothers.
The section that particularly relates to the contaminated milk products is
• Labels must ... include a clear health warning.
Any violations should be complained about and this is what I am hoping will happen as more people read this thread. As well as complaining to particular companies, you can read about the latest violations and also contact Baby Milk Action at
http://www.babymilkaction.org/
So what exactly are you upset about then? There seems to already be quite large restrictions on the companies - what is it that you object to exactly that they are doing wrong? so they provided some formula after the Tsunami.......big woop - with all the babies who were suddenly motherless, I would have thought this was definitely needed and warrented in the circumstances........would you have preferred the aid companies had to go and buy it off them? As we know, babies can't survive long without food - so IMO there would have been no time to wonder "is this really needed and how many babies don't have mums handy.....etc....etc" and sort all this out - food was needed for these people quickly as by the tiem it got there many days had already passed anyway. If a few womens breastfeeding schedules were upset by a few formula feeds.......surely that's better then letting babies starve in the interium? Besides - it IS FACT that if a mother is dehydrated and unwell her milk supply decreases - so you would prefer those poor women who'd just survived a Tsnami and must have been feeling totally awful - still persist with breastfeeding?? How exhausting and draining and bad for THEIR health that could have been? Knowing a person who went to Sri Lanka to assist - well - it was chaos and ANY foodstuffs and help were needed adn needed FAST..........this type of silly and impractical hysteria is what pieves me so much about the extreme pro-breastfeeding lobby at times...........get off your high horses and come back down to earth.
Sure - it's information Mimi - but it's very one sided and it could have been provided in a much more polite and gentle way. I imagined how I would have felt reading that when I was agonising what to do about my feeding and feeling VERY fragile..........and I KNOW it would have really upset me and made me feel like an awful mother and paranoid about the safety of the food I was giving my child and probably would have made me cry..............what I am saying is that women who are facing these decisions simply don't need to hear such harshly worded, fear inducing arguments.
T
willsmum
22-06-2005, 07:09
I have to say upfront that I have never used formula, so haven't ever needed to look into the pros/cons of different types.
mimi, you are obviously trying to give people info that would be relevant to them.
Tannie, I can understand that deciding to bottlefeed is a major decision and hard enough without having scary facts thrown at you.
I don't think there will ever be an easy way to present unpalatable info to vulnerable people. Maybe mimi could put right at the start of her posts that she is about to present info that may be upsetting to some people. (you know, like TV ratings warnings about suitability??) Then people could decide for themselves if they think they can cope with it.
Tannie
The reason it was such a big thing that children after the Tsuami were given formula, is that the 'health workers' were showing women who were obviously still breastfeeding [the SAFEST possible wasy to feed babies in a place where even clean drinking water was next to nil] were given instructions how to formula feed and given formula.
It is a myth that sterss 'dries up' mothers milk - and even if a mother is dehydrated and starving, though it may be her body that suffers, until she gets help, the baby will be nourished. To stop doing the thing that would be their best protection in this situation, is really beyond comprehension.
Babies have survived many a disaster simply because they were being breast and not formula fed. In large floods in Australia, my sister remembers hearing on the news about a baby that died because he was formula fed and the parents were stranded and could not get food for him. As she sat in the car, stranded between two swollen rivers herself, she was so glad she was breastfeeding her own child.
And yes, there are many restrictions already already on companies - which they continue to violate! Exactly the reason people need to know.
I don't consider it 'silly and impractical hysteria' to try and protect our babies, and I am sorry that I cannot offer this information in a more friendly and gentle manner.
Sometimes the truth hurts but it doen't make it any less true ... or necessary to know.
Hi willsmum
Have just seen your post - yes maybe this thread should come with a warning!! I agree .... but maybe formula cans need to as well!
:)
I will continue to disagree.................
It's interesting that it's breastfeeding mothers who feel the need to "warn" we bottlefeeding mothers of all these health warnings about bottle feeding and formula? Why do you feel the need to? Do you think we aren't smart enough to work things out and decipher the "scary facts" for ourselves? don't you think we get sick to death of hearing how "bad" and "terrible" formula is and how better off our baby's would be if we just "persisted with breastfeeding"?? :mad: I for one am VERY SICK OF IT and I come into these sorts of forums for understanding and support - not MORE OF THE SAME I get everywhere else I go.........
My personal opinion would be that if you want to campaign the formula companies to smarten up their act and "warn" of the dangers of formula - do it elsewhere........this thread is for bottle feeding mums and their issues and problems - for them to get support NOT for breastfeeding advocates to ram down our throats what terrible dangers there are for us and our baby's.
Besides, we all have our antecdotal "stories" - I have actually known baby's who have survived thanks to formula........... :eek: Imagine that?!!
T
mumofethan
22-06-2005, 07:41
I can understand where u are coming from Tannie,
my son is still alive as is my stepson due to the invention of formula... when my son was born i breast fed him, however my milk supply was very weak and watery therefore it did not fill him up so i made the difficult decision to change him to formula. I was in tears when i made this decision but i did it for the best of my baby.
As with my stepson, his mum never got any milk... and i am talk NIL... what was she supposed to do? let her baby starve...
we both coped a lot of flack when we fed our babies formula... i to get sick of the "scare tactics" and "scare facts" given by other mothers, mainly breast feeding ones. I read all the information i could lay my hands on when i decided to switch... and i am assuming that most other mothers have done the same...
perhaps this "information" could have been placed in a "scary rumours about formula" thread?
:D
Michelle
[/QUOTE]Don't you think we get sick to death of hearing how "bad" and "terrible" formula is and how better off our baby's would be if we just "persisted with breastfeeding"?? :mad: I for one am VERY SICK OF IT and I come into these sorts of forums for understanding and support - not MORE OF THE SAME I get everywhere else I go.........
My personal opinion would be that if you want to campaign the formula companies to smarten up their act and "warn" of the dangers of formula - do it elsewhere........this thread is for bottle feeding mums and their issues and problems - for them to get support NOT for breastfeeding advocates to ram down our throats what terrible dangers there are for us and our baby's.
[/QUOTE]
Hi Tannie,
After reading this entire thread, I would just like to say thank you, and that I entirely agree with what you have said above. I admire you for having your say, and although I have never personally been attacked myself by anyone for choosing to bottlefeed, I know friends who have, and the mental effects it has had on them. So, thanks again.
Kirsty
To All
Though I have never attacked mothers for formula feeding - or said anywhere here that you should continue to breastfeed against all odds - I am sorry that some have interpreted it that way.
As I said in a prior post, if breastmilk is not available, the only sensible thing to do is formula feed!! Everyone knows that. AND I REPEAT -it is not the formula feeders under attack here, but the formula and the companies that provide it.
I hope all your babies, how ever they are fed, continue to grow and thrive happily - as is our hope for all babies in the world.
I'm 100% with Tannie on this one.
Thanks for the info but unless you are going to do something constructive (like format a letter we can print off and sign to be forwarded to the companies) this doesn't need to be furthered in this section (i think it is going to go round and round!)
As for the flood story- lucky for your sister but its a bit of sensationalism in my opinion- do you know why that women was formula feeding and how do you think she felt- any less of a failure?? Please, a little bit of compassion and support in the bottle feeding thread.
Lets keep it positive and not go like last couple of weeks- I need this forum :)
(posting at same time as Mimi!)
Funny how I am allowed to be personally attacked - but the formula companies are not?
However, I agree. This thread should stop right here.
This has become one of those horrible 'breast versus formula' debates that I specifically said, in my first post, we were going to avoid.
So lets just leave it at that.
sopolicha
22-06-2005, 08:29
I know it has been said before on this thread and on others, but I am convinced that my breastmilk dried up from stress. I reckon I did everything to keep it going that I could of done, including doctors, hospitals, natural therapies, but with what was going on in my life at the time I had no chance.
Until you are in that position of having a baby that is not breast feeding for whatever reason and you decide to bottle feed I think the last thing on your mind is "Oh my god I can't feed my child that because of what this company does to children in Africa" I know that this is a small minded opinion but it was certainly the last thing on my mind when my daughter was "fading away" (she was only 4 pounds, 11 to start with) and it would be again if I was in that situation. The only thing you are thinking about is how can I feed my child.
The decision to bottle feed after breast feeding is surrounded in enough guilt as it is. I don't agree with how the companies market their products around the world, but leave the consumers of the products alone. In this instance, we have no choice. If breastfeeding is not an option, how else are we going to feed our babies.
Luckily we do not live in a third world country and do you really think that with all the food standards and regulations that exist that we are going to be knowingly supplied with a product that is detrimental to our children.
I think I have gone on more than enough -
Ummmm..........don't play the victim here Mimi - methinks you knew exactly what sort of emotion you would stir up when starting this thread :( It's not good enough IMO to start a thread that one clearly knows is going to upset people in such a forceful way and then throw in a bit of a disclaimer to try and justify it and then when the heat gets too much say "oh - maybe we should stop this thread" when it starts to not go your way...... :mad:
If there ARE mums out there struggling with breastfeeding or feeling sad about changing to formula etc who have read this thread........please don't let the negativity of this thread upset you more.......it's just not worth it.
T
I also agree with Tannie 100 % here, first off this is a thread for bottle feeding mothers, as i can tell mimi u r not bottle feeding so why are u posting here? Yes u think we need to know this information, why?? What do u have to gain from making mothers that have to bottlefeed feel like s***? I know for one i didnt need to see this post in a place where i come to look for HELP not hinderance. Yes u think we all needed to know all this information, did it not occur to u that if we wanted to know we would ask for it?? You want to do something constructive then get on the companies back about this stuff , not in here. I come in here to get help and talk to ppl that understand not to listen to ur comments about formula and there companies.As Tannie said, dont u think we feel guilty enough already not being able to breastfeed without hearing this? U should of found another thread to post it in not here.And yes formula companies go over and give there products to ppl in need, so what? what about the mothers over there that were bottlefeeding there children?? What dont they deserve to get formula for their baby's ? I think mimi u should just get off ur high horse and go find another thread to post in because it is quite obviuos no one here wants to hear ur bullsh#t. Im sorry but this kind of s*** just p*** me off , sorry guys had to have my say , TO ALL THE MOTHERS OUT THERE THAT HAVE TO BOTTLEFEED, DONT FOR ONE SECOND FEEL GUILTY ABOUT DOING IT , UR BABY WILL THRIVE AND IT DOESNT MAKE U ANY LESS OF A GOOD MOTHER FOR DOING IT
Though I had agreed with others that this thread should stop, because it had taken a nasty turn, the one who 'turned it nasty' seems set on continuing ... Tannie??
I am not sure what my 'disclaimer 'was, Tannie, and the suggestion to discontinue was - not because, as you put it 'things weren't going my way' [?] though I am sure you really have no idea what 'my way' is to know that, Tannie - but because it had degenerated into a non-productive slanging match.
To Bridget - the reason I posted in the 'formula feeding' section was because it was in regards to formula??? Seems obvious to me, if not to anyone else.
I am constantly amazed how some people can take one person's statement of facts as a cause of their inner guilt. I can understand the hurt many women feel when they cannot continue breastfeeding, and I would not ever try to increase that hurt in any way - nor would I have any reason to do so ... could ANYONE have any reason to do such a thing? I have already made statements to that effect so there is no need for me to repeat!
If anyone is feeling any sort of guilt, my suggestion that you should not, will probably fall on deaf ears ... but that would be my suggestion anyway.
No doubt someone will also come back with some comment that will, once again, be aimed at me and serve no real purpose, but I think this WILL be my last post on the subject [really this time :) ] - not because I feel like 'a victim', but because I can see no good purpose being served by continuing this exchange.
also mimi just a question for you?? have u gone into the c-section forum to tell them how dangerous that is?? or the ivf thread?? Have u taken all the statistics into them and told them that what they may b doing, having to do is bad and wrong ???
No doubt someone will also come back with some comment that will, once again, be aimed at me and serve no real purpose
Yep - just like this entire thread....... ;)
T
StormAngel
22-06-2005, 10:20
Hi
As a mum of 4 kids 2 of which were bottle fed and 2 who were breast fed (am currently weaning #4) I find Mimi's original thread disgraceful, all right these companies may be doing something wrong, but for those who can't breastfeed, what other choice do they have but to give formula!
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