eggs vs sperm & legal issues etc

[alicesmum]

have been following these threads a little bit and wanted to pose a couple of questions for the egg donation advocates/experts!

if you know lots about egg donation stuff and/or have been personally involved with it, would you mind taking a quick skim of this thread i recently started about sperm donation:

http://www.bubhub.com.au/community/forums/showthread.php?t=17382

the overwhelming feeling of the ppl who responded was that they would not feel cool with their partner donating sperm (nor donate eggs themselves).

anyway, my partner ended up saying no to my query about donating to a good friend of mine due to potential future legal issues. however, I have put the offer of my eggs out there already (though am very hopeful she will still fall with her own eggs) and now am freaking out a bit about the legal/child support type issues.

to illustrate, an ex-colleague of my mothers who is gay wanted a baby, so she made a casual/informal agreement with a gay male friend of hers and, using a turkey baster, got pregnant to him. she was 39 and the child (who is now ~ 6 months) ended up having Down's Syndrome and the mother is now hoping that the biological dad (who was never going to be involved) will help out physically and financially (as I imagine a Downs child is lots of hard work). She has a female partner, but is now hitting up the dad as well. This is the kind of scenario that scared the cr*p out of my husband.:eek:

However, they didn't have a legal agreement beforehand. however, DH (who is a solicitor himself) says it doesn't really matter anyway, because there are caveats and because they could change the laws at any stage in the future and that would simply invalidate whatever contract you developed in the first place.

Can someone tell me how these issues are not the same for egg donation (or are they?)

thanks in advance!!!! :p

[sarahstarfish]

Hey Alicesmum

Great reading in the other thread!

When you donate through a clinic, you sign a document releasing you from all responsibility and liability of eggs/sperm once fertilised into embryos. This is a binding legal document. All laws regarding donor conception in Australia have been 'henceforth' and never retrospective. I have donated twice, about to go again, and the legal side of things does not concern me one bit.

Re the situation where a lesbian couple have a child from a sperm donor and there are future health issues, it would be very hard to pin him down given he donated sperm to them and wanted no part of parenting/supporting the child when the decision was initially made, a decision they obviously agreed to.

I think we hear so many horror stories from the US, where things are done just so differently with agencies and solicitors and huge sums of money involved. But personally, as long as the paperwork is filled out honestly and all tests taken, I think a donor is extremely safe in donating and not regretting it down the track, well financially at least.

Love

Cindy

[xkwzit]

OK pessimist's hat on now...

But if they (your donor child or their custodial parent) contacted you and were in financial difficulties, could you be so hard hearted so as not to give them money? Even if legally you didn't have to? A question that you'd need to consider...

[provencein3]

Once you set a precedent how do you stop it occuring again.

[alicesmum]

X you're a clever lady. we thought exactly the same. in fact, my DH said that even if the legal side of things was completely "stitched up"... if the child ended up being seriously ill or disabled, or if you did find out mother and child were having a really hard time of it, you would feel oblidged to help out. and yet, as kim said, you set a prececdent and then feel oblidged ever more (like my mum does to her dirt poor unemployed sister who she regularly gives money to and now can't say no to! so i guess it happens in other relationships too!)

anyway, the sense of obligation he would feel for the child is what stopped him from saying yes, as much as the potential legal issues.

it's just such a hard issue because to give the gift of a child to someone who can't fall, but who wants a child so badly, would be so awesome.

i wish the ******** government would let my friend adopt a child from o/s who is otherwise living in poverty :mad: :mad: (don't get me started!)

[xkwzit]

Oh YES AlicesMum. Don't get me started in the difficulties of O/S adoptions either. I know that ppl must be properly screened and evaluated, but to place a paltry hundred (200 300, whatever) or so kids a year because of understaffing is RIDICULOUS.

*OK off soapbox now will skulk off somewhere else*

[alicesmum]

x, my friend will never be able to adopt because she is single and by the time she meets and has been with a partner for 2-3 years as required, she will be disqualified for her age. she would pass the test on every other criterion though. financially very stable, extremely sound morally, and lovely lovely lovely.

it is ludicrous that a child who she would love and nurture and provide everything for will, instead, be half-starved in an orphanage in Cambodia somewhere.

anyway, off my sopabox now too. :(

[Roxy]

I *think* it depends on where you are adopting from and the agency you use.

I know of quite a few single women in Canberra who have adopted children, from China and Ethiopia. One of these women is "due" to collect her new daughter from China very soon.

[xkwzit]

Hi Roxy
Something buried in my memory says that it's prob different state to state. I know that age restrictions vary, prob marital status does to.

However now with my mod hat on :chef: I'll say that this is a bit off topic and if we want to keep discussing o/s adoption rather than egg/sperm donation we should start a new thread.

Unless AlicesMum has all the answers she was after????

[sarahstarfish]

Hey Ladies

Interesting discussion - they are two separate issues though aren't they, legal and emotional. Legally, there is no doubt in my mind that the legal contract signed to protect both recipients and donors is water-tight - I just can not see a court in Australia allowing a completely legal agreement between two parties to be dabbled with.

With regards to financial support for a donor conceived child from a donor (and now I think we are truly talking completely hypothetical as even in the evil US this has been reported a handful of times and only with outside-clinic sperm donations) I think it would depend on how the donor saw their donation - some see their gift of genes as about as important as donating blood. Others, thankfully the growing majority, understand that their unique genes are going to create half of a life that will in most likelihood, want to know where they come from, meet their donor and their genetic half-siblings, and have hundreds of questions. WIth a known donor, it would be very hard to say no to 'friends' in need and the lives you understand have come from you....would certainly be a no-brainer for me.

Love

Cindy

[provencein3]

Here's another side to this story.


A potential donor mentioned to me that some donors may not be able to get pregnant themselves and can't afford IVF so will donate and then try and prove that the IP's are incompetent parents.

This is a discussion so multiple sides of any story should always be allowed therefore no comments about the potential donor who mentioned this. She's a fabulous person. But have you ever heard of this happening Cindy.

[sarahstarfish]

Hey K

Sounds like some bad Neighbours plot to me.

Cindy

[jason lovett]

i wouldnt believe anyone if they tell you being a donor you are perfectly safe egg or sperm signed or not circumstances change and so can legal agreements not to mention rules,regulations and laws not to mention governments etc..this is where im different as im from ireland i dont have any legal standing in a court of law in australia and also a woman can not claim maintenence off me as im not a resident just here on 2 yr temp....if you not sure just ask any lawyer how much power australia has over other countries with this kind of situation and because of the strict rules on donors in australia this is pushing australian women overseas knowing they come back pregnant with no trouble of this kind in the future..i know a girl who got pregnnt in london came back and centre link said they will get maintenence off him thn they turn around and tell her they have no legal right to make him pay and the only way is for him to voluntarily pay by his own choice and i also know an english girl on holiday here in australia who got pregnant and same with her went home and tried the same thing..most countries dont want to know because they the government end up with the bills......because im not a resident is why i cant go to a clinic to be a sperm donor....

[provencein3]

Jason there is a forum smcaustralia.org - single mothers by choice...if you're not adverse to single women being mothers ...who I'm sure would welcome your offers of donor sperm.

[mauve]

so will donate and then try and prove that the IP's are incompetent parents.

As a now single woman following my divorce, this has probably been my greatest fear with regard to donor egg/sperm. While I bear no ill will toward this potential ED (I know that we can go to immeasurable lengths to hold our own bub) it frightens the cr*p out of me. The most important thing a child can receive from it's parent/s is love. Too, too many children are being raised by couples in a couple's home where that home is less than happy. But, would I have a legal leg to stand on as a single woman with one income -vs- a couple if the worst were to happen?

I had two unsuccessful IVF cycles last year with donor sperm and may possibly be seeking an ED later this year (:fingerscrossed: for my one last cycle with my own eggs in three months). That then creates two lots of donors and double the complications if I want to be really paranoid :eek:

Can anyone suggest anywhere on line that sets out what the legal implications or precedents are?

[provencein3]

There's an articled in the Brisbane sunday mailtoday about two children conceived from donor sperm "finding" each other as a result of a registrar somewhere. new legislation had been bought in in the UK so the donor can seek out the parent but they mentioned it wasn't retrospective.

Anon donation does have advantages in that regard does it not.

I would think though that simply because you are a single parent on a single income vs possible dual income is not sufficient ground to take a child away. The chi;d's wishes would have to come into play somewhere. However don't know if there are any legal sites...perhaps do a google.

[jason lovett]

thanks provencein3,
i ve tried to register but having trouble login on.. my email is
johnyboy30@hotmail.com
im usually on msn messenger after work pm the days go by so quick i'll be back in ireland before i know it i hope i can help someone to create the gift of life they surely deserve like every woman and at least i will know having such a great time here i will be helping someone here in australia i feel its te least i can do for my time here....